The floods in the late 90s did some major damage to the fishery.

The track from redpaths was washed away and few ventured up the river. Those that did found the fish few and far. The bonus to this was the Deer numbers rebounded back big time as most found the going to hard without a track - in return this sparked off the helicopter boys who took advantage of the best deer hunting in decades. Over the past 3 - 4 years the the deer market has dropped away and the pressure has once again come off the deer. Pigs are also doing real well around the forks hut area. so if you are a hunter then this is the bonus to come from the floods.

I usually ring search and rescue Opotiki for a update on tracks hunting and fishing as these guys spend allot of time in this area.

The river was coming right last year - the recent floods have obviously caused more havoc on the fishery.

Fish and game rotorua keep a close eye on this river - send them a email as I am sure they are keen on any recent news from this area. Even a phone call is appreciated so they can plan for the future with your feed back. I spoke to Steve Smith a few years back and he concerned how we would find the fishing after the big floods. He would be keen to hear how you found your recent trip.

Browns are no more cannibals than the rainbows. If they were the river would full of big fat browns right? But you say you only saw one small one? The old myth that browns are cannibals is just that a very old myth. trout are opportunists and eat what they want when it is available. A raibow will happily eat its young, so will a Brown.

 

As a Councillor for eastern Fish and Game I can tell you the staff have a good handle on the fishery. The floods are, as herring correctly pointed out, the culprits. releases would be a massive waste of license holder revenue. Our fisheries are largely self sustaining. Wild trout fisheries, that's what makes them the envy of the world. The only places in NZ where releases can be justified are fisheries with limited spawning. To release 10,000 fingerlings into the Waioeka would be so much a waste as to just pour the license money into it. One flood would take them out too. The fishery will recover and you have to hope Mother Nature allows it to, as Herring said, it had, but the recent floods have done more damage. That's the way it is with a managed wild fishery.

I have to say I get a little pissed off when someone has a bad fishing trip and their first move is to start moaning about Fish and Game. To post on a forum and need to have someone point out that you should perhaps contact them to one pass on the information and secondly to get some real handle on it would have been, I would have thought, most people's first port of call. Fish and game is a system set up to be run by license holders... it only will be when license holders participate on that level by involving themseleves rather than just moaning about days when they don't catch fish.

 

Fisheries management moved past releases year ago because it isn't sound management practise as proven worldwide. Releases will almost never be the answer to improving a fishery and in most cases will actually damage it.

 

The fishing in NZ has changed for ever and fisheries like the Waioeka that have reletively easy access get a hell of a lot more pressure now than they did even 5 -10 years ago from the increase in Kiwi anglers and tourists... it will have its effects and we have to expect that.

 

If I sound touchy consider this. You make the statement "I pay my license fee like everyone else" and you want something from fish and game for it???

I pay my lisence fee like everyone else, I spend my time and my petrol money and running costs to sit on the council and help the fishery and the game then the thanks we get for it is people saying we are doing nothing. So I, for one, am doing more than just paying my license fee and I get the same fishing and abuse... what a great ****ing deal!

If you want a Put and Take fishery then expect your license fee to soar over $1000 per annum to sustain it and even then that probably wouldn't do it. If you have some suggestions on how we can stop the floods of recent years in the future please let the Council know, Steve would be pleased to know.

 

Clark

 

Give credit to Steve Smith.

I am very passionate about the Rotorua Fishery because of guys like him. Rotorua is run by guys who care about the fishery and guys who care about what the angler has to say eg - their good and bad days fishing experiences. A switched on bunch - you can his passion for the river in the email.
(As for Taupo - its run by a group of sandel wearers who for many years have not understood the fishery or why people choose to fish there. Only in the past 3 years are DOC starting to understand what goes on. Hell the information they write about in target taupo was passed onto me by some very old locals 30+ years ago (with exception to how far the trout move around the lake - part of the data logger excercise)Just have a look at licence sales from the late 80s to present- anglers have voted with their feet, more are fishing Rotorua than Taupo while once the other way around)

Taupo is a sad fishery compared to what it should be while Rotorua offers so much variety.

Dunnit - you will have to go back and try again. Obviously you missed the fish that were there. Personally I think its a fishery that is very fragile at the moment.

Instead of releasing fish, a river should be closed for angling for a couple of seasons, giving the fishery time to recover. If anglers are not being successful then this will benefit them in the near future. Looks like Rob and Steve have information showing the river is on the up since the big floods at the end of the 90s.

Cicada - how does one go about the process of closing a river for fishing until the fish numbers get back to a healthy level.

Dunnit - While its a lifestyle thing for your dad and uncle they must consider the fishery for future generations.

Have to back fish and game - there are so many good lakes and rivers in the area - some years they fish well others not so well. Above all the guys at F&G love their fly fishing and love the river you talk about. Its this passion that is most important. DOC in Turangi employ a bunch of out of towner BCS' who have no connection or gut feel for the fishery - its all book learning.

There are two basic factors that effect the numbers of trout in the river
1/ Nature. F&G cant control that.
2/ Anglers - (your dad and uncle)The more anglers the larger the harvest = less fish
Now F&G can control the harvest - Limit the catch bag or close the river.
If it is indeed so bad that you are catching so few fish then closing the river would provide a benefit for yourself in the near future - I am sure your dad and uncle would see the benefit in that. They would probably enjoy the benefits when the river reopens. Reduceing bag limits wont work as the access tracks have meant more angling pressure which has resulted in a bigger harvest

You also focus on F&G expenditure - one of the biggest things turning me away from the eastern area is access tracks. I want to believe that I am fishing for wild fish in a wild environment. Now a track suggests that access is fairly easy, hell why not just build a mall like they do in the states. These access tracks are what increases angler numbers which in turn increases harvest. This is possibly a reason you are catching less fish.

Steve mentions that they are seeing fish where you are not fishing. This makes me believe your dad and uncle are fishing where there is a increased harvest and easy access.

I believe the solution to increasing your catch is.
1/ Explore a little further to waters that recieve less pressure.
2/ less flooding of the river.

I've just come back from a 3 day trip on the Waioeka. My 3 sons and myself managed to catch just one trout a 4lb Rainbow on Dryfly. The scenery is magnificent, shame we saw so few fish. Even with 7ft rods, 3wt lines and virtually crawling to the river, the fish saw us and zoomed off in panic.
This was about 2hrs trek from Redpath, so we tried the top end and hiked towards Koranga Falls. Again beautiful scenery and unspoilt. Saw a few big fish, but just as easily spooked. Also noticed that the Koranga stream bed was covered in a slimy residue. Incredibly slippery. Water wasn't as clean as the Waioeka. Could this be due to nutrients from farmland? As for Fish & Game. We are from the UK and moved to NZ for the lifestyle/fishing. You honestly don't know how lucky you are here. I often fished the River Test with corporate clients and paid approx $700 a day per person to fish half a mile of stocked river. This was on top of the Rod licence. Fishing in the UK even a day on stocked reservoirs (some concrete bowls) costs more than a NZ licence. Everywhere we went we saw signs showing angler access. Your fishing appears to be very well managed. While we were dispaointed not to catch more fish, I put it down to not knowing the river, and the wrong tactics. Having said that, I wish we'd seenturua Lake. Still there's always another trip. Now if only I could get

Quote: Originally posted by dunnit on 10 January 2006

---

but when the lakes get releases every year even though they have a wild population then thats where you shoot yourself in the foot..

---

 

There are no Lakes in New Zealand with a sustainable wild population that is stocked.

 

Everything Herring has said makes perfect sense and I won't bother adding to it. Except to say that if you want to know more about what Fish and Game are doing you need only read the relevant pieces of the magazine or for more indepth info try requesting a copy of the Management plan... you'll get it.

Clark

 

Yea the scenery at Waioeka Gorge is amazing!  Tho I think it has its secrets, and thats why some people have trouble catching fish sometimes.

Tho good effort SH2 for catching one, I hooked up on my first cast in that river, thought it was going to be a god day, was not, only fish caught all day.

I only get out trout fishing rarely but I fished the Waioeka early this season and all I can say is that both the environment and the fishing were fabulous. My first visit too. Like SH2 I walked up from Redpaths and released 9 good fish, losing around 5 more on #2 wt gear. Best fish was around 6 lbs. Rivers change with conditions, we must have good days and bad.

The fenced off river, keeping stock at a well managed distance is a credit to Bob Redpath and any others involved. A beautiful river, clear water and challenging trout. Staying at the Redpaths farmstay was great too.

I could walk the Waioeka, not catch a trout and have a wonderful day.

Neal

Had a wad load of rain Sunday should be fishable (if not now) but for my preference towards the end of the week.

If it is, then it will do more good then bad. think that place might need a break!