Hi everyone,

how compact and light, yet capable and versatile can a single rod setup for river and sea, trout, salmon, snapper and other species be?

This seems to be an incredible forum and web page, thank you very much already to everyone who is contributing to this place, I have learned a lot from reading here already!

My Name is Matt, and I don't know much about fishing right now - very successful experiences in Norway during my childhood and a more recent and probably very lucky "Garfish madness" in Oz aside.

I am pretty keen on changing that though, and I would like to try to do that without too many avoidable detours.

So straight to the point: I have worked out pretty clearly what exactly I want to do. Hoping that the one or the other of you has the time and is keen to take this little challenge, I will describe what I am after and kindly ask you to tell me how you would go about to achieve this best - and especially what gear you would use.

Here's what I want to do:

=> Fish off the rocks, in river mouths, and in rivers around Christchurch during the week

=> Fish in rivers across the South Island, mostly during tramping trips

=> Fish in fresh water
- for trout
- for salmon
- for anything else that's tasty

=> Fish in salt water
- occasionally and optimistically for salmon
- for anything else that's tasty

=> Fastest and easiest way to get the fish is priority, since limited time for fishing on tramps
=> Avoid fly fishing if possible
=> Avoid having to carry any live bait
=> Minimise the weight and bulk of my equipment as much as possible

=> I want to do all that with one single rod; I can live with the fact that that will always be a less than ideal compromise. I might consider two different reels if that helps, but I only have space for one rod.

=> The rod should fit INSIDE my full size backpack. I simply know that any rod attached to the outside will be damaged sooner rather than later during bush bashing sessions.

=> As an additional question, what rigs and lures would you use as a good compromise between compact packing and light weight for backpacking on the one hand and on the other hand versatility for all the different locations, species and situations I am going to encounter?

As to the rod, I have carefully started to eye pack rods like e.g. the Eagle Claw ones. What do you think of them or similar pack rods, what are your experiences, what would you suggest?

I think that even with the better pack rods I would probably have to be extremely careful not to snap them when (if) catching bigger trout or salmon, right? Or is there a compac-packing rod that is really up to that task?

I am good with my hands, so if there should for example be any pack rods that can be modified to be suitable for what I want to do, I'd be keen to hear.

Unfortunateyl, I won't be able to use a second longer rod for fishing around Christchurch during the week, since the rod will need to just be stowed with other stuff that I'm carrying around with me on different occasions "in case" I will go fishing afterwards. It still needs to be about the length of a larger back pack at most.

Well, that's "all". Probably the answer will be that I'm looking for the impossible ideal fishing kit that everyone would like to have but that's impossible to create - but any thought, idea or trick that you can possibly contribute to get me closer to a reasonably suitable setup will be much appreciated.

THANKS!

Cheers,

Matt

I recently sold a 4 piece shimano catana rod that came with a nice little hard case about 50cm long. It was paired with a shimano sahara 1000 reel, spooled with 100m of 6lb fireline. I have caught snapper up to 8lb on it over the sand, and I would say it would be fine for trout as well. Also good for squid, and spinning for kahawai. A big salmon would be too much for it though. It would easily fit inside a full-sized pack and weighs hardly anything. Definitely worth looking into.

Hi again,

thanks for the quick and detailed answers, that's a good start!

smudge, in what way do you mean it would limit my chance for salmon? By casting distance, by simply breaking, or something else? And yes I would be worried about a breaking rod. Thanks for pointing out local regulations, I'm aware of that and am gathering the info at the moment.

Tele29, PJay: Do you happen to know the gear each other of you is recommending? And if so, what do you think of it? How do those two rods compare in strength? I would prefer strength over sensitivity, to an extent.

Tele29: How much would I have to invest in your suggestion?

PJay, your suggestion sounds very much like what I'm after, I will look into that. It sounds like a worthwhile investment since I'm serious about doing quite a bit of fishing, still the price tag hurts a little. On the other hand I can see already that if I go the seemingly cheap route first, I'll end up paying more in the end. As a greenhorn I have to ask: How is upriver salmon different than further down? Are they more tired already so they are less hard on rod and line?

All: Thinking about a big fish breaking the rod, I just had a thought: How about using those shape-memory titanium rings that release the hook from the rest of the gear at a precisely defined load (forgot the product name, does anyone know?) to prevent that from happening?

They are normally used to minimise loss of equipment when snagging, and should be selected so that they release the hook just before the breaking strength of the line is reached as far as I remember.

The unlikely but possible really big fish would be gone for me that way, but they would be gone anyway because they would break the rod and / or snap the line; using these "release rings" at least I would keep the rod intact.

Cheers,

Matt

People who target Salmon at the mouth use long rods (10-12ft) and fairly heavy lures (68g tricers) to cast long distances, and often punch through head winds. The rods need power (6-12kg) to play the fish through the currents created by the river mouth and the surf. 

Further upstream, where casting distances are shorter. Most salmon anglers drop down to 22g Zed Spinners.  The rods are shorter, and a bit lighter. They need a 22g spinner to get the lure quickly to the bottom where the Salmon hold. 

Trout anglers, typically fish lighter gear again. They typically use spinners in the range 7-12g and use low diamater and breaking strain line to reduce the chance of spooking the cautious fish. 

Getting one rod, which can fish all three is basically impossible. So you would have to forget about river mouth surf fishing and concentrate further upstream.  You would need wither a 4-piece rod, or a telescopic rod. I prefer the former but like neither.

I personally would purchase a trout combo, which has the potential to handle Salmon. Looking on Trademe there are two 4-piece rods.

Okuma GR 664 SPXL. Its 6'6" long, with a cast weight of 4-14gr.  A bit light for casting the heavier Zed spinners but 14g zeds should work. Rod is rated 3-6kg.  I would either pair it up with a Abu Soron, or a cheaper option would be a Penn Slammer 260. These two reels I feel offer the best value for freshwater use. Alternatively, get the best Shimano in the 2500 size you can afford. 

For line I would use 6lb fireline braid. Then a 2m leader of 8-10lb for the bigger rivers, and for small clear streams might use  6lb Flurocarbon leader. 

For Salmon fishing, I would use 14g Zed Spinners.  When targeting trout, I would go for a selection of Spin-blades, tobies (4-7g), pre rigged soft plastic lures (tsunami pro sold in kmart),  and maybe a couple of Minnow lures (Rapala, Yo-zori) if budget allows.

Hi again all of you,

thank you so much for your incredibly helpful advice! I very much appreciate your time, you are helping me to avoid spending money on the wrong things and you are also helping me catching more fish in a shorter time. I'm really starting to get excited, it will be the first time ever that I will be fishing with a good setup and at least some idea what to do!

If I will ever get to a level of experience where I feel that that is appropriate for me to do, I will pass on your helpfulness and do my best to spread the knowledge to other beginners.

smudge: I'm very aware how powerful salmon and other large fish must be. I was very impressed with the strength of the (albeit large for their species) garfish that I caught recently, and if a larger fish is accordingly more powerful, that will be an impressive challenge no doubt, especially for a greenhorn like me. I am hoping that some other skills that I have will help me learn that reasonably quickly, namely river and current reading (from whitewater kayaking and swiftwater rescue) and an understanding of fluid dynamics and mechanics (being an engineer). Time will tell...

Militaris: Thanks heaps especially for specific numbers, very helpful.

River mouth and surf casting are the scenarios out of my selection that I might be willing to give up or accept severe limitations; maybe I will buy a second rod for that at a later date if I find that I do it often enough to be worth it. 

What exactly does trout combo mean? I'm still learning the nomenclature.

From my questionable gut feeling, I tend to think that the rod should be able to handle 22g Zeds if possible. Is 14g to 22g any significant difference, or am I nitpicking? I'd just like to avoid being limited by my gear as much as possible within my already quite tough restrictions.

PJay: Another greenhorn question that I can't figure out right now: What is point loading in this particular sense?

Thanks for clarification; if the casting distance is all, I'm not too worried. I can accept that limitation and just choose my location accordingly, i.e. move further upstream, for example. As long as the rod doesn't fall apart, all good! I think I'll be at least able to learn to get the most out of the rod length that I will have, I don't seem to be too bad at that already and with learning more I should be able to maximise that. Of course, that will never come close to longer rods casting distance, but that's ok for me.

Do you think those release-rings would at least make sense to limit loss of lures and line, so you only loose the hook when snagging?

How can I learn / where should I read about how to set appropriate drag?

180 or 270 degrees is both pretty impressive, sounds like good design and workmanship.

THANKS AGAIN!

Matt