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NZ or Oz Bass Grouper?

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    Posted: 09 Dec 2015 at 6:17pm
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The pic below was on an US forum and there is some discussion with respect to the species and where it was caught.  The pic has been around for some years now and I believe at one time was published in some fishing magazine.  Looks very much like a bass grouper to me and I thought someone out there may have seen the pic and could shed some light with respect to the species and location of capture. 
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Lethal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Dec 2015 at 6:46pm
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here you make the comparison, Karps massive 75kg Bass viruses the above pic.

ive added another pic in reverse so its a little easier to compare.


Thanks for everything you did for us Eric. may you rest in peace, You were one of the real legends of NZ recreational fishing
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Gowest Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Dec 2015 at 12:56pm
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it does look like a bass, but the boat looks very American I must say
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote sid fishus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Dec 2015 at 1:48pm
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polyprion americanus,

same as ours basically, otherwise called 'wreckfish'.

As far as I unnerstan, they are found widely across the pacific and atlantic, so probably widely over the world.

Same species or very similar. No doubt someone will know more or do some googling on 'wreckfish' or 'polyprion' polypriondae etc.
I always tell the truth about things that never happened
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Lethal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Dec 2015 at 2:34pm
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your onto it Sid,

Googled:  'wreckfish'
Range & Habitat: Wreckfish are found in the western Atlantic Ocean from Grand Banks, Newfoundland, to La Plata River, Argentina, and in the eastern Atlantic Ocean from Norway to South Africa. They migrate throughout the North Atlantic during their life cycle. Although they’re found all along the U.S. East Coast, most of the commercial fishery operates over the Charleston Bump, located 80 to 100 miles southeast of Charleston, South Carolina. Wreckfish are also found in the western Indian Ocean and in the Southwest Pacific Ocean near New Zealand.
Thanks for everything you did for us Eric. may you rest in peace, You were one of the real legends of NZ recreational fishing
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The discussion re identity has thus far been split between Warsaw Groper and Wreckfish (polyprion americanus) and now Bass Grouper has been tossed into the mix.  Most acknowledge it is not a Warsaw Groper and many believe it is not a wreckfish - polyprion americanus either.  This has been supported by an ex long liner who targeted wreckfish in days gone by and he states that he has never seen a wreckfish that looks like the one pictured.  His comment is that wreckfish are longer and leaner rather than the short and fat shape of the bass grouper and that they always have the popped out eyes.
I came across the following web page which is interesting.
http://bigfishesoftheworld.blogspot.it/2012/04/wreckfish-polyprion-americanus.html
The top three photos are NZ captures and then the two below are the fish in question.  All fish are said to be wreckfish - polyprion americanus which is clearly incorrect.  I do agree however that the bottom two photos do have an American flavour about them.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Lethal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Dec 2015 at 5:51pm
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Polyprion oxygeneios

is definitely our Hapuku,
but appears to have been confused with our Bass

From Wikipedia
he hāpuku, hapuka, or whapuku (Polyprion oxygeneios) is a wreckfish of the family Polyprionidae, found around southern Australia, Chile, Tristan da Cunha, and New Zealand at depths between 30 and 800 m. Its length is between 60 and 180 cm, and it can weigh up to 100 kg. It is


here is the bass Tony Wong caught and i believe these guys are more switched on than most,

when we went to the Three Kings we caught them along side of each other in a dept of 60 to 80 mts
will put that pic up when i can find it for you.
    
Thanks for everything you did for us Eric. may you rest in peace, You were one of the real legends of NZ recreational fishing
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Lethal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Dec 2015 at 6:43pm
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even back in 1980s there was always problems distinguishing one from the other,
i put these two pic to help people back then ID the difference,
quite easy when you see them side by side.



Thanks for everything you did for us Eric. may you rest in peace, You were one of the real legends of NZ recreational fishing
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Lethal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Dec 2015 at 6:55pm
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NZ should have, 
 Bass Groper (Polyprion moeone),
 Hapuka (Polyprion oxygeneios) 
 Wreckfish (Polyprion americanus)
 Really spoiled....

this from distribution map from  fishbasel and even they get it wrong,
they beleive we dont have any Bass.. 

Distribution of Hapuku



Distribution of Bass




Thanks for everything you did for us Eric. may you rest in peace, You were one of the real legends of NZ recreational fishing
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote pjc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Dec 2015 at 7:19pm
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Heres a Hapuka caught off tasmania today


Sex at 58.Lucky I live at 56
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote pjc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Dec 2015 at 7:23pm
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and 2 blue eyed trevalla caught same time never heard or seen them before

And no it is not me but friends who live in tasmania

Sex at 58.Lucky I live at 56
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote kiwifred Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Dec 2015 at 8:55am
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i thought the easy way to tell the diff is.

Hapuka have a protruding lower jaw.
Bass dont
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Lethal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Dec 2015 at 1:15pm
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that is correct kiwifred, problem most pic have the mouth wide open and its hard to tell,

the easiest is when they hit the deck the colours are quite a lot different,
Bass look like camouflage pants, they are covered in blotchy dark and light colours,
Hapuku are just grey, trouble is once dead they both look the same in colour,
then its about body shape Bass being fatter through the middle and Hapuku being thinner longer in shape. 

take note: this is how easy it is to tell the two fish apart when still alive,



Thanks for everything you did for us Eric. may you rest in peace, You were one of the real legends of NZ recreational fishing
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