Leader problems.

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    Posted: 01 Jan 2014 at 5:22pm
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Hi all,
When I cast my leader comes off like a spring and a get the occasional wind knot in the braid.
I have a Stradic 8000FJ and it's spooled with 50lb powerpro,
I have been using suffix zippy supple 100lb mono as a trace is there a better leader to use?
Thanks
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote ginga Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jan 2014 at 6:04pm
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Suffix zippy is pretty good for casting in my experience, is it possible the leader may be too long.
www.extremesportfishing.co.nz.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote laidbackdood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jan 2014 at 6:55pm
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There are loads of theories for the causes of wind knots but you can find a vid on you tube by fuji using kw guides that are anti wind knot guides and actually shows you how wind knots are formed.........I have those guides on my top shot lalandi and have been using a 5 or 6 metre leader(most like to use short)......both myself and aaron have used it land based......I have never had a wind knot and ive done plenty of casting....must be the kw guides but i dodnt think aaron has those on his carpenter rod.
I will see if i can find the link on you tube and add to here(its good)...........if you dont have those guides and you dont want to cough on an expensive rod.......make sure the leader is supple........varivas or prosele (both available from yeeha)...........if you want to go budget black magic supple trace but varivas is very good for the price and 130 pound is about the normal thickness of 100 pound line.........100 pound varivas should be minimum and up to 170 ish.....make sure your knot is neat.............Dont use flouro...too stiff.....supple mono is the go..I use a 1 inch PR knot(approx)for casting....a lot of people use the FG knot(most popular) but both work.

Once the idiots turn up..Im outta here...No time for Drama Queens.
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Originally posted by ginga ginga wrote:

Suffix zippy is pretty good for casting in my experience, is it possible the leader may be too long.

I'm using about 6m of leader joined with a PR Knot.
I use it for jigging also and don't fancy trying to tie a good PR Knot on the boat.
Should I be using a shorter peice of mono like when softbaiting.
Thanks
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Ara Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jan 2014 at 7:07pm
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Originally posted by laidbackdood laidbackdood wrote:

There are loads of theories for the causes of wind knots but you can find a vid on you tube by fuji using kw guides that are anti wind knot guides and actually shows you how wind knots are formed.........I have those guides on my top shot lalandi and have been using a 5 or 6 metre leader(most like to use short)......both myself and aaron have used it land based......I have never had a wind knot and ive done plenty of casting....must be the kw guides but i dodnt think aaron has those on his carpenter rod.
I will see if i can find the link on you tube and add to here(its good)...........if you dont have those guides and you dont want to cough on an expensive rod.......make sure the leader is supple........varivas or prosele (both available from yeeha)...........if you want to go budget black magic supple trace but varivas is very good for the price and 130 pound is about the normal thickness of 100 pound line.........100 pound varivas should be minimum and up to 170 ish.....make sure your knot is neat.

Hi thanks for the info,
My guides are the std old style, my knots are very tidy, I may try some of the varivas leader do use mono or fluro?
Thanks
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Titahi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jan 2014 at 7:15pm
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If your spool is too full of line, it will  leave the spool lip faster than it leaves the rod tip, this will cause wind knots.
Make sure that the spool isnt over filled.

It still possible to get wind knots with K guides and plenty of casting rods have been built without them that work fine.


"I love standing by the ocean and just knowing what its for"
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote ginga Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jan 2014 at 7:20pm
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6 metres is way too much, prob a big part of your issue. The suffix zippy is a supple trace I use it a lot and don't have the issues you mention.
PR is not the best but keep it short and it should work fine
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote ginga Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jan 2014 at 7:21pm
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Like titahi says too, if your spool is over full you will have issues.
Biggest issues I see on my boat are when guys turn up with too much line crammed on a spool,
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote laidbackdood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jan 2014 at 7:33pm
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A long PR could be an issue..Plus small guides......are the top 3 guides room enough for knot to pass freely? make the PR no longer than 2 inches for casting ....i use 1 to 2 inch but nearer the one inch(one inch actual PR and then half hitches) and its strong.......varivas casting mono....go to yeeha for that.
with 50 pound braid.....100 pound varivas would be good.
here is a pic of the varivas but as ginga said ....he reckoned what you are using is good and he would know.....he runs a charter............I would check your knot.....make sure its tidy and run the shorter leader for now and see how you go..but even so....wind knots seem to be one of those things i am afraid........it just hurts when you lose a lure worth more than your rod! ...i saw a guy lose a carpenter and another french lure in one afternoon to wind knots( expensive lures).......Both Aaron and Boulder present at the time......Good luckWink

Once the idiots turn up..Im outta here...No time for Drama Queens.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote laidbackdood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jan 2014 at 7:45pm
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Originally posted by ginga ginga wrote:

Like titahi says too, if your spool is over full you will have issues.
Biggest issues I see on my boat are when guys turn up with too much line crammed on a spool,
yep.....this tooWink
with a 5 or 6 metre leader....you dont have this issue because you need more room on your spool to store the longer leader.........this might be another reason i dont get wind knots because my spool is a bit more under full ....not full to the brim with braid and a 1 to 3 meter leader.......plus i have really big guides on my synit lalandi(love this rod)....when i cast....I dont feel a thing as the line passes through the guides............make sure the lure is hanging down around a metre from rod tip(thats the trick).Just have a good look around you before you let lose!
Once the idiots turn up..Im outta here...No time for Drama Queens.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Ara Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jan 2014 at 8:45pm
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Hi guys,
Thanks for the suggestions, my PR Knot is closer to 5" long than 1" so I will shorten it right up.
What length leader would you recommend ginger?
My knots are very tidy but I do feel it pass through every eye when I cast.
Thanks
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote kaveman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jan 2014 at 8:57pm
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Learn the FG knot mate(PR are great for jigging but not as good for casting) and leader about 3m at most.
www.kavemantackle.co.nz
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote ginga Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jan 2014 at 9:06pm
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Kaveman is onto it learn the FG, casts much better. Plenty YouTube tutorials around.
For leader length if you have a lure hanging about a metre off the rod tip then your leader should be just touching the spool. Hope that makes sense
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Falco Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jan 2014 at 9:36pm
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I use about 1.0-1.5m drop when casting large lures and have the knot between the first guide and the reel seat, so I guess that makes my leader about 3.0m or so.
I prefer not to cast with leader on the spool, I think it slows everything down a lot.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Aaron32987 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Jan 2014 at 9:46pm
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I use a 5 m x 130lb leader from the rocks with no issues, but as Titahi mentioned, the spool is about 5mm or more from being full.

The longer leader potentially saved me just the other day when a fish nailed a lure in 3m of water and took off sideways with a big rock between me and it - the leader was nearly on the rock for a while before I could scramble across to follow the fish. Got my lure back and landed the fish as well...

The only time I've ever had major issues with wind knots was with one particular lure, which gave me all sorts of grief and hours of unpicking braid nests before the lure finally busted off and flew 100 m, finding its freedom and giving me mine from those bloody wind knots. Never understood why this one lure gave me such problems - I've got others from the same family which never give me any issue.

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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote alan syme Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jan 2014 at 6:56pm
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good advice from kaveman, ginga and falco.

I agree with what they say.

I used to get wind knots with long leader and pr knot, a few years ago I changed to fg knot and leader set up as they said and I have not had a wind knot since.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote brmbrm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jan 2014 at 7:37pm
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Is the leader knot on the spool when you cast, or off the spool (obviously with 6m leader i guess itsd on the spool!).  maybe the weight of the leader knot makes it fly out sideways and cause the problem?
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote laidbackdood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2014 at 2:42am
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Originally posted by Aaron32987 Aaron32987 wrote:

I use a 5 m x 130lb leader from the rocks with no issues, but as Titahi mentioned, the spool is about 5mm or more from being full.

The longer leader potentially saved me just the other day when a fish nailed a lure in 3m of water and took off sideways with a big rock between me and it - the leader was nearly on the rock for a while before I could scramble across to follow the fish. Got my lure back and landed the fish as well...

The only time I've ever had major issues with wind knots was with one particular lure, which gave me all sorts of grief and hours of unpicking braid nests before the lure finally busted off and flew 100 m, finding its freedom and giving me mine from those bloody wind knots. Never understood why this one lure gave me such problems - I've got others from the same family which never give me any issue.

you used to use 170 pound leader too.....a aaron?........i think my leader is 5 meters too but mainly because i want to use off the boat and the bricks and i havent had any probs.......only the future will tell for me but to date...its all good.........the fact i am using reasonably hefty lures helps also i think.Dont know if i would be keen to use it on lighter lures/set up.
Once the idiots turn up..Im outta here...No time for Drama Queens.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Aaron32987 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan 2014 at 8:34am
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Yep, used 170lb varivas for tiger country - no problems with this either.
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