2016/17 Temp Closure of Scallops Southern Fishery

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    Posted: 09 Jun 2016 at 7:04pm
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Looks like the Top of the South Scallops are going to be out of bounds for at least this year from the email i got before!!!


So whats every ones views on it?

I know i wasn't too happy when the commercial scallop fleet was allowed into Tasman Bay this year and screwed over one of the last beds in the bay which had very limited numbers of scallops in it, no where near commercial quantities they said it had but had to say it was loaded to get in there. In fact they where out of there in 1.5 days after they couldn't catch enough scallops.

So whats your view people?
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote mowerman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jun 2016 at 7:17pm
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History repeats ..we all know what the problem is ..Some are are saying it all happened in the past ..bullswool ..take all ..It happened in the H/G as well ..Strip it, destroy the sea floor ,it aint coming back in a hurry
 
MPI ......You allow this to happen under your world best practice methods of sustainability Quota Management for JK and his rich mates ..
 
They screwed over the Mother bed in the H/G as well.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Capt Asparagus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jun 2016 at 7:47pm
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If the fishery has been that badly hammered there, it is good they are shutting it down. It wasn't that long ago it was held as a poster boy of sustainable harvesting, especially with the commercials paying for a reseeding program etc. What happened?
Yes, I am happy to concede the answer is most likely over harvesting by the commercials, but have there been any other factors in the diminishment of the resource, like disease of the beds or anything?
As for the huge beds in the outer gulf, well, that is a whole other story...
But really, John Key is personally responsible for commercial over fishing of scallop beds in the Marlborough sounds? He hops on the phone to his rich prick mate on the dredge boat and tells them to head down and rape and pillage while he keeps the fisheries folks distracted??
Sighh.....Sometimes things can happen in NZ without the PM actually being personally involved you know. Ki kara.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote mowerman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jun 2016 at 8:07pm
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This is what happened to the H/G scallops ..yes its been copied as pasted ..

Just before Xmas 2012 the Ministry for Primary Industries (MPI) released a proposal to increase the existing 22 tonne Total Allowable Commercial Catch (TACC), by either 295% or 454%, to 65 or 100 tonnes respectively.

These increases were based on the discovery of a new, significant scallop bed in deeper water of the Hauraki Gulf.

Both industry and the Ministry supported a TACC increase.

We objected to any increase until there is better information.

In March the Minister, Nathan Guy, agreed to increase the TACC from 22 to 100 tonnes. The allowances for non-commercial interests, recreational and customary, increased from 7.5 to 10 tonne each, but there is no change to individual daily bag limits.

The decision will apply from 1 April 2013.

as for Tasman Bay

 all-time peak of 1246 tonnes in 1975. That was when around 250 boats were dredging, some of them double-crewed so that they could work around the clock.

It couldn't last. By 1980 the catch had fallen to 41 tonnes and the Government, which must share the blame for what had gone on - it kept issuing licences - closed down scalloping.

since then attempts at reseeding had an increase but recent past its collapsed again.
Silting and seabed damage are being cited ..Yes the damage done by constan
t dredging has destroyed the habitat ..
The government has now closed the fisheries again ....Yes they are to blame ..no phone calls to the boats by JK ..But bet you me the all had shared knowledge and input to this
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Capt Asparagus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jun 2016 at 8:26pm
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Yes, that is well known, they ramped up the TACC...., the annoying part is that a lot of the extra harvest was taken not from the open water HG beds as intended, but from the beds closer to base at whitianga, which is pretty rude really.
Has the TACC been reduced again yet though? I seem to remember seeing something about it having been dropped once more....I think it has been but could well be wrong.
Increasing the tacc to allow harvesting of that huge new bed was always both rational from a harvesting point of view....scallops don't live that long, the argument was if they weren't harvested they'd just die anyhow, but equally justifiable and smarter to my point of view is that this must have been a massive reseeding resource that quite likely has been quietly keeping the existing known beds going all these years, and as such should have been left alone.
It will be interesting to see what , if any, long term effects the extra harvest has had.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Gatekeeper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jun 2016 at 8:29pm
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The writing has been on the wall for over 10 years and regardless of what happened to the scallops (beds dying, run off from farms, silt from de-forestation, over fishing etc) its very plain to see not reducing the TACC until the fishery is rooted like now has been the main cause of this mis-managed fishery falling over.

You only have to look at their own data - look at the TACC and look at the harvest figures. No fishery is going to sustain nearly 800 tons getting ripped out of it year after year. 

Even when the catch figures were down to double digits (which is a long way from 800 tons) the TACC was not lowered. 

The commercial sector in this case have not caught their allocated TAC for years which only means its been set to high (mis-managed)

Why has it taken 13 years to get a reduction in the TACC?



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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Gatekeeper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jun 2016 at 8:39pm
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I guess it not un-expected as it collapsed in 1980 and the pattern was similar to now apart from they know seeding isnt working now.


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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote mowerman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jun 2016 at 8:39pm
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What appears to be a problem is the damage to the sea floor ,allowing silting to occur because the sea floor has been destroyed by constant dredging ( all sea life balance destroyed ) sea weeds, sands ,crabs everything gone Just looks like a marine desert . I have seen the same thing when diving.The beds are hammered then collapse with just shells and starfish . This then gets covered in fine silt ,Kawau, Whangaroa , BOI.
Reseeding will not work if the sea floor is inhospitable as it will kill the small spat
It wont work as they have destroyed the eco system ..Blame it on deforestation or climate change they will ...but 1973 sowed the problem now at hand ,plus continued pressure to fish when recovery was underway  ..
 
Continue to harvest a rate faster than replacement = extinction
 
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Originally posted by Capt Asparagus Capt Asparagus wrote:

Yes, that is well known, they ramped up the TACC...., the annoying part is that a lot of the extra harvest was taken not from the open water HG beds as intended, but from the beds closer to base at whitianga, which is pretty rude really.
Has the TACC been reduced again yet though? I seem to remember seeing something about it having been dropped once more....I think it has been but could well be wrong.
Increasing the tacc to allow harvesting of that huge new bed was always both rational from a harvesting point of view....scallops don't live that long, the argument was if they weren't harvested they'd just die anyhow, but equally justifiable and smarter to my point of view is that this must have been a massive reseeding resource that quite likely has been quietly keeping the existing known beds going all these years, and as such should have been left alone.
It will be interesting to see what , if any, long term effects the extra harvest has had.
 
I remember seeing about six scallop boats coming into the te kouma boat ramp on a daily basis with hundreds of bins of scallops from the h.g bed. I even went past one day and saw them all steaming north with their dredges down. I said then that the scallop fishery in h.g would be stuffed within three years due to over fishing. you can still get a feed but its not as easy as it used to be. My dad told me once that he used to dive behind waimate and get his limit without ever leaving sight of the anchor!! you wouldn't do that now
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Capt Asparagus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jun 2016 at 9:08pm
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I think those figures are very telling Gatekeeper....it would also be very interesting to know the CPUE (Catch per Unit Effort) on the harvest they have got.
The damage scallop dredging does, same as bottom trawling, same as scampi/prawn/shrimp dredging is a crime I think. The dredging of the entire HG in the early 20th C, wiping out the almost solid mussel beds and turning it to a sand and mud desert is one of the worst ecological disasters in our country, and is almost totally unsung.
Too late to do anything about that now though, that was 50-100 years ago.
Thing is..... the sale of the product, scallops, is almost a bottomless market, perhaps reducing the demand a little may help ease the pressure on the beds.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote mowerman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jun 2016 at 6:53am
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Scallop industry Will collapse on its on accord as they have been allowed to plough up and ruin the seafloor . Dredging is the most destructive methods used as it is non selective .
They just keep going to nothing is left.By that time the eco system has been destroyed and will not support any type of marine life
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Southern_Jez Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jun 2016 at 7:02am
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make scallop harvesting dive only like paua (but with scuba tanks), create a few jobs, increase the value of the product to cover increased harvesting costs ... to simple?
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Derek F Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jun 2016 at 7:20am
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MPI is a disgrace....and has been whether under National or Labour

And the trouble is, if you don't risk anything, you risk even more...Erica Jong
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote mowerman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jun 2016 at 7:43am
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Yes ..agree.diving would protect and restrict the amount taken.Slower but the eco system stays healthy
They cannot keep continue what they do .Put themselves out of a job is what is happening. .

As for Mpi..worse than a disgrace.
BOTH..labour and national are equally to blame..but under national and it's think big policy's have increase pressure by allowing increased harvesting.The effects of that are showing now.
National show little concern about sustainable methods.
What happens as stocks decrease increase effort by commercial ends up decimating remaining stocks.
By the time Mpi do anything to preserve what is left it's to late.
For any recovery to take place 10 year closure to allow habit to reestablish.
Methods have to change to sustain any rebuild
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We used to jump over the side in 14m off Puheke beach and get our scallops in 10mins then use our tank balance for a cray dive.
I am only talking 5 or 6 years ago it all ended.

For 6 years we watched the commercial boats plough square ks of beds with millions of scallops day in and day out till they were gone.

There were enough there for generations of divers to come and raising population numbers to still have a great morning out and a super feed.

I can't get my head around the whole "they might die anyway so lets kill them" argument either.

Scallops need numbers to breed (bio mass) they just have a squirt and hope to get lucky from what I hear.
You need a lot of girls around for that trick to work.

Crays are so declined up here it is a joke also....very sad.

I have been told Doubtless was full of scallops once also.
I know what happened to them as well...same same.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote mowerman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jun 2016 at 8:17am
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MPI In charge of our Fisheries is like giving matches to pre school students..
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Originally posted by mowerman mowerman wrote:

MPI In charge of our Fisheries is like giving matches to pre school students..
 
Who do you propose putting in charge then?
 
I've got a great idea, why don't we get a collection of educated people, that have studied fisheries science and that kind of thing, then assemble them into some sort of agency.... but they'll need funding and some sort of delegated authority, so they better be part of the government. In fact we could get a whole lot of people who specialise in different areas like agriculture as well, then make a big well-funded organisation... it could be a ministry even. Since agriculture and fisheries are considered "Primary Industries" the name is pretty easy too, we'll call it the Ministry of Primary Industries! Problem solved?
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote mowerman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jun 2016 at 9:13am
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Mpi need a make over. .name is ok. But independent from Government control.
It's recommendations have to be listen to
Made up by independent people in no way connection to government.meaning not picked by the government or we end up with what we have got again
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Capt Asparagus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jun 2016 at 10:05am
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If you do that then you get shonky, looney policies imposed such as those imposed....briefly but devastatingly....in Australia on the trucking industry which banned truck owners from driving their own trucks...immediately put 36000 trickiest out of business.
That was the result of a real commission report recommendation by an appointed "independent" body of experts.
National , labour, green, who ever, all are advised by their officials as to what course to take on any specific issue. The huge increase in the HG scallop quota was not determined by john key in Wellington on a whim, it was decided on by fisheries officials (yes, likely in Wellington, but that is irrelevant), and then announced. It had zero to do with any govt policy, it was a resource allocation thing.
I don't LIKE it, I think it was a very poor decision, but you simply cannot say it is all the national party's fault, that's like saying the car that crashes into your front fence is all your fault coz you were running you property at the time (that allusion needs some brushing up, but as I am currently sitting here.....

...at the moment, I simply can't be bothered)
To make scallop harvesting all by diver only, that ain't going to happen, unless you like paying ten bucks for a scallop. However, there are less damaging dredging techniques out there I think that could be explored.
It is only my overwhelming natural humility that mars my perfection.

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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote mowerman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jun 2016 at 10:40am
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Unfortunately blame does go back on National to chairman John key and all his merry men.
Their increased export drive policy has been at the expense of the marine life as they have increased the commercial take.
As stated..taking it faster than it can breed.
Maximum amounts being harvested have seen it collapse.
The sea bed destruction which will not support re seeding..
They know it destroys the habitat .
As for that mother bed.yes maybe it might have died out..but who really knows? Maybe it had been reseeding itself and surrounding areas for years.
It won't now will it ?
Plus all other beds stripped out.
That has upset the natural balance.

What rocket scientists do they have advising them that all is well when history and nature has shown it's not..Eg H/g mussels
All these filter feeders are part of a balanced eco system.
They talk about water quality. .look what they are doing to degrade it..
There has to be a balance..clearly they don't care about balance and tipping points or they wouldn't embark on this continued over havesting of all species
They are fishing themselves out of a job.how narrow minded is that ?
Maybe it's A good thing everything collapse around them. Then they can all blame each other.
Most of us know where the problems stem from.
Some don't care..some think we are a bunch of moaners .Well the likes of Greenpeace. Legasea and all us moaners help in changes and conservation
The industry and government have to be held accountable for their actions
They don't own the fish..they manage..what a   shyt they do.They don't manage it..it's all or nothing
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