Stick Baits

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    Posted: 22 Jun 2012 at 3:08pm
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Titanium
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What's the difference in the different types you can buy...????

Some of them are mega bucks and you cant blame someone to want to just hang it on the wall and look at them rather than chuck it into the water for a fish to devour or scour up..LOL
Floating, Sinking the different hooks, barbed un barbed, different weights, one would use and why....

Please share your experience...

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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Gruntled Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Jun 2012 at 3:41pm
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My 2 cents.....the expensive ones, Carpenter, Killer etc, cast much better further and action on retrieve is more attractive. I think when fishing tough or into wind go with the costly ones, easy fishing with wind any old stickbait will do.

Regarding hooks some need the trebles for their action, others don't. Singles and Baker rig kinder on the fish you release.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote laidbackdood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Jun 2012 at 4:43pm
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Have to say some are works of art.....I have been using all sorts off the bricks and havent had any joy yet but in primo spots like white/ranfurly/three kings...it would be time to play...my time will come.
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Yes but what are the benefits or disadvantages of floating and sinking.... which has been more successful and why  ???  how can simply changing out a treble hook change the action of the stickbait???

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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote laidbackdood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Jun 2012 at 5:19pm
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Aaaagh.....I can answer some of that......surface or sub surface when worked stickbaits are more suited to calmer conditions and tend to be the most popular here....sinking stickbaits are best when there is swell running as the surface ones will come out of the winter when its choppy.
I have used surface sticks off the bricks because not in my ineterst for it to sink but on the boat i plan to use sinkers more....i know they use them in the tropics a lot....they can be seen better...
as for trebles/singles....some are designed to be fished with trebles eg carpenter....most prefer barbless for catch and release...some can be used with singles=two single hooks or baker rig=one single off the back and two underneath,back to back.....they do less harm to the fish......If you want a basic stickbait thats good value...the shimano ocea pencil is a good start(the bigger one) can be used with 3/0 owner trebles or 7/0 singles...easy to work...has rattles and finish is good.
sure others can input more here.
Once the idiots turn up..Im outta here...No time for Drama Queens.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote laidbackdood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Jun 2012 at 5:24pm
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 how can simply changing out a treble hook change the action of the stickbait???
Carpenters are designed to be fished with trebles....the weight and balance make the lure work properly and they need to be the right size for the lure...The ocea pencil can be worked with trebles or singles...sometimes a lure will work better with singles as they are lighter...so you can experiment with it but some are not like carpenter.If you put the wrong size trebles on eg to big...it can ruin the action of the lure.
Once the idiots turn up..Im outta here...No time for Drama Queens.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote ReelAppealLures Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Jun 2012 at 9:35pm
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Originally posted by *fisher* *fisher* wrote:

What's the difference in the different types you can buy...????

Some of them are mega bucks and you cant blame someone to want to just hang it on the wall and look at them rather than chuck it into the water for a fish to devour or scour up..LOL
Floating, Sinking the different hooks, barbed un barbed, different weights, one would use and why....

Please share your experience...

Hey Fisher,

Quite a few questions here so we will break it down...

Big bucks doesn't always equal great baits, but as a general rule most of the more expensive baits have had more development therefore making a better final product. The cost of developing, prototyping, testing and manufacturing the lure needs to be recovered in the cost, hence the higher price. Many of the high end lures are not made so much to a price point (within reason), you will find the construction and components to be of a higher quality. 

The term "Floating" is used very loosely, but these are made to be surface lures... How the lure sits in the water i.e the angle or attitude is a factor to how the floating lure will work also... Some floating lures are made to suspend, or even work subsurface; I still class these as floating lures.

Sea conditions can sometimes dictate what lures can be used, with highly active surface lures spending more time out of the water than in it sometimes you have to change tact.

Barbed or Barbless... I would think the majority of sport fishermen are fishing barbless or crushed barb hooks on whatever hook they may choose, treble or single. Collateral damage to the fish is reduced and tangoing with a green fish boat side will have you thanking yourself for crushing/removing the barbs. There is also the added benefit of if in the event the fish is lost, barbless hooks increase the chances of A. The fish shaking the lure free and B. You getting the lure back if its a floating lure.

Differing weights...

Usually with the increase in weight the baits size is scaled up. Having a range of sizes can help on days when fish are being selective. Make sure you check your rods lure casting range stated on the blank and remember that most lure weights are stated without hooks so you may need to factor in this as well. Try to match your lure weight to what feels right with your rod of choice, don't get suckered into thinking heavy lures will cast further when all it does is saturate the rod and limit your casting. Match them up and cast confidently and smoothly all day.


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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote ReelAppealLures Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Jun 2012 at 10:03pm
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Originally posted by *fisher* *fisher* wrote:

Yes but what are the benefits or disadvantages of floating and sinking.... which has been more successful and why  ???  how can simply changing out a treble hook change the action of the stickbait???

Once again, will try answer these as best as I can...

Both floating/sinking lures are effective, as to one being more successful it would depend on your target species; but for YTK the floating lure is very popular when the fish are active on the surface making it a good lure to have. Many would simply jig for YTK if they are not responding to your lures.

The treble hook is balanced in its design, the three hook points are very stable and hydro-dynamically friendly. Have a look how the hook rests on the belly of the lure... one point down acting as a keel, and a hook point either side of the lure balancing the hook out. Now when it come to lure design the weight and position of the hook become important, and also the coverage or exposure. Some lures rely on the treble hook to effectively "keel" the lure and provide what is called righting moments, this is where the body of the lure rolls out and is then "righted" by the keel effect of the hook, this effect can also be built into the lure or not depending on design. If the lure does not "right" itself it rolls out and will spin; so if the design of the lure was built around the hook, its position, weight and balance changing it can throw the lure off. This is the basics of how a lure "swims"... Well it doesn't swim it sheds water pressure, so how it sheds this pressure creates the "action" but we need to control/create this action and sometimes it is done by using specified hooks/sizes to get the correct lure attitude.

Best way to see this is to change out hooks and experiment. No harm in trying things out. 


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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote tas-tackle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Jun 2012 at 10:18pm
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Great info guys.... really appreciate you taking the time to answer....  thank you...   bit wiser now and hope your answers will help others who read these posts...

Any more input....   appreciated...    but I want to know "why" you make your choices when you answer so I have a better understanding with what to do and choices to make......

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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote laidbackdood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Jun 2012 at 10:26pm
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No Prob....another point worth noting.....is try to match the hatch.....I like black/silver as they look like sprats...blue/silver looks like pilchard...green/yellow as they look like jack macs and dark blue/black look like koheru....starwalkers for example, look like native new zealand baitfish......pinks/reds etc tend to be preferred  for the tropics....feel free to mix your techniques for working them too.
Good info from sam(RAL)....good oil from a lure maker.Wink
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At this point I only own 3 stick baits and 4 poppers....  I tried to find heaps in the shops in Hawaii  but only ONE shop had ONE stick bait...  A Daiwa Saltiga Dorado  A bargain I thought at 19 us dollars..
Standard answer from the reps when asked.." no one asks for them, no one uses them.. so they dont stock them"  Guy said the Saltiga had sat there for a long time...
Its hard to choose when you dont know what you are looking for...
Oks.. so that brings me to another question...  land base and boat...  would you use the same stick bait for each .......

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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote PoppinTonga Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 2012 at 7:38am
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Just on the floating and sinking question.....I was introduced to a different method of fishing with stickbaits this week.  Apparently it is the rage in Okinawa.  Finding steep drop offs in the 40-70m range with bait suspended about half way down.  This angler casted a 200gr sinking stickbait and let it sink through the bait towards the bottom.  Then the lure was retrieved in a slow to medium constant speed just twitching the tip of the rod.  Kind of like jigging with a stickbait.  We did not have any luck doing this, but he told me stories of some very large GTs caught this way in Japan.  I plan on giving this method a try on my own to see if it works well here in Tonga.  Might be an interesting idea for Kingies also.
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Originally posted by PoppinTonga PoppinTonga wrote:

Just on the floating and sinking question.....I was introduced to a different method of fishing with stickbaits this week.  Apparently it is the rage in Okinawa.  Finding steep drop offs in the 40-70m range with bait suspended about half way down.  This angler casted a 200gr sinking stickbait and let it sink through the bait towards the bottom.  Then the lure was retrieved in a slow to medium constant speed just twitching the tip of the rod.  Kind of like jigging with a stickbait.  We did not have any luck doing this, but he told me stories of some very large GTs caught this way in Japan.  I plan on giving this method a try on my own to see if it works well here in Tonga.  Might be an interesting idea for Kingies also.


This is the reason why Konishi developed Carpenter Katobi...the lure was designed to do exacly this technique....
FORGET MECHANICAL JIGGING...SLOW STYLE IS WHERE THE FUTURE BE....
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Originally posted by kIWir kIWir wrote:

Originally posted by PoppinTonga PoppinTonga wrote:

Just on the floating and sinking question.....I was introduced to a different method of fishing with stickbaits this week.  Apparently it is the rage in Okinawa.  Finding steep drop offs in the 40-70m range with bait suspended about half way down.  This angler casted a 200gr sinking stickbait and let it sink through the bait towards the bottom.  Then the lure was retrieved in a slow to medium constant speed just twitching the tip of the rod.  Kind of like jigging with a stickbait.  We did not have any luck doing this, but he told me stories of some very large GTs caught this way in Japan.  I plan on giving this method a try on my own to see if it works well here in Tonga.  Might be an interesting idea for Kingies also.


This is the reason why Konishi developed Carpenter Katobi...the lure was designed to do exacly this technique....

Typo Kiwir, Pandora not the Katobi...

Kurt I have just the lure on my bench at the moment, I will get one to you to test out for me...Will send over with a client coming in a few months. Should be interesting to see where heavy sinking stick baits fits in with YTK.
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Originally posted by ReelAppealLures ReelAppealLures wrote:


Originally posted by kIWir kIWir wrote:

Originally posted by PoppinTonga PoppinTonga wrote:

Just on the floating and sinking question.....I was introduced to a different method of fishing with stickbaits this week.  Apparently it is the rage in Okinawa.  Finding steep drop offs in the 40-70m range with bait suspended about half way down.  This angler casted a 200gr sinking stickbait and let it sink through the bait towards the bottom.  Then the lure was retrieved in a slow to medium constant speed just twitching the tip of the rod.  Kind of like jigging with a stickbait.  We did not have any luck doing this, but he told me stories of some very large GTs caught this way in Japan.  I plan on giving this method a try on my own to see if it works well here in Tonga.  Might be an interesting idea for Kingies also.


This is the reason why Konishi developed Carpenter Katobi...the lure was designed to do exacly this technique....


Typo Kiwir, Pandora not the Katobi...

Kurt I have just the lure on my bench at the moment, I will get one to you to test out for me...Will send over with a client coming in a few months. Should be interesting to see where heavy sinking stick baits fits in with YTK.

Spot on there mate....
FORGET MECHANICAL JIGGING...SLOW STYLE IS WHERE THE FUTURE BE....
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote PoppinTonga Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Jun 2012 at 5:32am
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Great stuff.  It is always fun to do the testing of new (to me anyway) methods of fishing.  Kei left me 2 sinkers to give this a go.  They are very heavy in the tail.  Vava'u has many deep/steep drop where I can test, both by land and boat.  Going to try them at the FAD also.

Look forward to testing your lure, Sam.  Always willing to help with such hard workBig smileBig smile
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