Help with top water Q's
Printed From: The Fishing Website
Category: Saltwater Fishing
Forum Name: Popper and Topwater Fishing
Forum Description: If you're into a bit of action on top, this is the forum for you
URL: https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=94079
Printed Date: 06 Jun 2026 at 1:07pm
Topic: Help with top water Q's
Posted By: PE Pete
Subject: Help with top water Q's
Date Posted: 07 Sep 2013 at 1:31pm
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Some help required guys! Starting to get a small collection of stick baits & poppers together but am far from experienced in top water lure fishing. So firstly my only rod/reel for top water is a multi weight 200-300G 7'6" Offshore 24-37Kg spin with a 08 version Stella SW 10K which has Jigstar 50lb braid on it. So thems the facts now for the ?'s Q: none of stick baits or popers that i have or can find are anywhere near 300G does this matter? Q: most have trebles as supplied which I am not keen on.If I change out for single or twin hook sets will this adversely effect the action of the lure? Q: split rings supplied with lures always look a bit under done to me. Do you gurus change these out or not? Q: Sebile magic swimmers got one of each size dare I use these on kings? trebles & split rings on these look particuly small compared to other such as Shimano Rapala! Got two trips coming up ext month both involving top water so appreciate any assistance. Cheers Pete ------------- Tight lines PE Pete |
Replies:
Posted By: JoshW
Date Posted: 07 Sep 2013 at 1:52pm
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PE Pete wrote:Posted By: PE Pete
Date Posted: 07 Sep 2013 at 2:01pm
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Cheers for that Josh any other input will be appreciated. ------------- Tight lines PE Pete |
Posted By: PE Pete
Date Posted: 07 Sep 2013 at 2:37pm
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Another Q: just came to mind. Am thinking of connecting leader to 37kg snap swivel thus allowing me to change lures quick & easy again is this gonna adversely effect action of the lures?? If so what's best option? ------------- Tight lines PE Pete |
Posted By: ET487
Date Posted: 07 Sep 2013 at 4:13pm
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I use ball bearing swiwel and split rings instaed of the snap lock. |
Posted By: rockz
Date Posted: 07 Sep 2013 at 4:18pm
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check this out pete, think there's some pics with poppers further down the post: http://360tuna.com/index.php?/topic/3693-intro-to-popping-by-gman-reference-for-beginers/" rel="nofollow - http://360tuna.com/index.php?/topic/3693-intro-to-popping-by-gman-reference-for-beginers/
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Posted By: PE Pete
Date Posted: 07 Sep 2013 at 5:26pm
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Cheers AJ that's a great thread with lots of info, like the swivel & split ring that will work for me. Was in ur shop earlier got the large version of the Sebile magic swimmer. Might upgrade rings & hooks before I go buffing that at big Kings. What do you reckon mate? Pete ------------- Tight lines PE Pete |
Posted By: rockz
Date Posted: 07 Sep 2013 at 5:40pm
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yep change out trebles, think singles would change the action though. swivel idea is good, one trace and swap around lures as needed.
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Posted By: corokid
Date Posted: 07 Sep 2013 at 5:49pm
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Hi Pete, A lot of top end stick baits are sold unrigged , so will have to purchase hooks and split rings. Owner probably the most well known brand , there are others . Hooks and rings. If thinking of using single hook set up you may want to consider inline hooks , little more expense but only require one split ring to attach, a conventional single hook will require two rings to have hook sit right. As stated previously all lures will have a set up that works best , thats part of the process , testing and experimenting. Personally I go single hooks if I can because I don't have many friends and fish by myself a lot.  Handling a thrashing kingi in or at the boat with trebles flying everywhere not ideal in any situation let alone solo.More advise , if not already source yourself a quality pair of split ring pliers . Pair of good quality well fitting gloves or finger guard on casting finger at least ------------- MNZ Recognised Marine Surveyor |
Posted By: Eastender
Date Posted: 07 Sep 2013 at 6:03pm
Adding to the great advice above, I like to remove (squash) all the barbs from the hooks on my lures. This makes it much safer for the fish and fisherman alike, and as long as you keep tension on during the fight it shouldn't make a difference. Easy to release fish and remove hooks from forearm
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Posted By: muchalls
Date Posted: 07 Sep 2013 at 6:10pm
| How about using 'tuna double hooks' on the belly and a big single on the rear? |
Posted By: PE Pete
Date Posted: 07 Sep 2013 at 11:39pm
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Thanks fellas got plenty out of this! Muchalls been looking at the double hooks I think that's how I'm gonna go with a couple of my lures that don't have robust trebles like the Sebile. Eastender am going to give flattening the barbs on those lures I'm gonna leave trebles on cause it's the damage to fish I wanna return that troubles me about trebles. Corokid cheers for your thoughts I see owner have every eccesary I could need. Expensive but real good quality. I already feel more confident about my upcoming top water trip with Nomad so cheers again boys good one. Pete ------------- Tight lines PE Pete |
Posted By: PE Pete
Date Posted: 08 Sep 2013 at 7:36am
You fellas have all been thanked. Pete   ------------- Tight lines PE Pete |
Posted By: Aaron32987
Date Posted: 08 Sep 2013 at 8:02am
Best thing to do is what you are doing - go out on a charter with one of the pros 
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Posted By: PE Pete
Date Posted: 08 Sep 2013 at 8:08am
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Yeah cheers Aaron it does make sense to me to do charters for many reasons not least to learn off the skipper & other anglers. Also get a lot out of discussions in here as well. Pete ------------- Tight lines PE Pete |
Posted By: fish i
Date Posted: 08 Sep 2013 at 9:39am
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Ignore the cast ratings on those offshores, they are well out of whack. Who wants to cast around 300g lures anyhow. That rod you've got is essentially a popper rod, the lighter version illusion is more for stickbaits. You'll find it near impossible to swim stickbaits with a swivel, all good for poppers thou. Mind you you'll have a hard time swimming stick baits w that rod anyhow. A good alternative I've found for swapping out lures is connecting your leader to a brass grommet and your split ring goes through that. Others use a bit of plastic tubing looped around and their split through that. Essentially you've got a good set up for chasing tropical species and the odd king. But if it's kingfish you are mostly focussed on I'd swap that rod out for something more suited to working stickbaits. ------------- 6th place in the inaugural Te Kauwhata Regionals paddle crab division |
Posted By: petethemeat
Date Posted: 08 Sep 2013 at 10:28am
Can you explain that? ------------- 
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Posted By: Fish Pimp
Date Posted: 08 Sep 2013 at 12:36pm
On some Stick Baits you will find a swivel makes the lure spiral/roll to much when it should dive wiggle and pop. (Floating models ) Much better imo to tie direct to lure with a little Leader sleeve from (Jig Star) to protect the leader from being squashed under pressure.
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Posted By: Legacy
Date Posted: 08 Sep 2013 at 12:56pm
| I always buy lures to match the rod I'm using,or a rod to fish the weight of lures I want to use; I don't know much about that offshore but maybe buy some nice heavy orions and maybe some 150gr poppers , use the rod for what its designed for , especially as a newby . Hopefully Ben or someone will lend you a classic kiwi stickbaiting rod so you can see the difference. |
Posted By: laidbackdood
Date Posted: 11 Sep 2013 at 2:18am
Personally i have fished all my stickbaits and poppers with either a 8 or 9 mm owner split ring and a size 1 NT swivel and they have all worked well....except for carpenters which need to be tied direct.Even fished waxwings that way too....easy to change over....That is pretty standard practice around the world....swivel and split ring/split ring pliers.The fact you like jigging makes pliers a "No Brainer".....Berkley do a cheap set that are reliable and do the job. Colin....Do you mean that red sleeve from jigstar? If i use trebles...I use barbless......squashing barbs doesnt always work well and can still catch. I like those in line shogun hooks esp for reel appeal lures and have used them on starwalker and shimano ocea pencils with a good action.......some poppers just need trebles unfortunately to balance out like has been said.. I have a few stickbaits i use a treble on the belly and and a big shogun on the tail.....pays to ask the best way to rig...when you buy them......Good luck  Here are a few...these caps are good too.Hope this helps  RAL lure Shogun in line hooks.  Owner caps  Bit of a gap in this split ring..watch for that(replace)  Baker rig with cable tie  Crimp and plastic tubing(from bunnings)
------------- Once the idiots turn up..Im outta here...No time for Drama Queens. |
Posted By: PE Pete
Date Posted: 11 Sep 2013 at 6:48am
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Hey Laidback as you have pointed out some lures will take a mod others won't. Having read all the responses for which I am great full I have realized like most styles of fishing there really aren't rules as such but there are many opinions & that rod, reel line class lure style & weight etc ect all contribute to the success or otherwise of your efforts. I done things a bit arse about face & have ended up with a great rod for poppers & a collection of stick baits. So at this stage will simply relax & purservere with the gear I have & be grateful for what I have. Thanks to all who have contributed above. Pete ------------- Tight lines PE Pete |
Posted By: fishntips
Date Posted: 11 Sep 2013 at 4:02pm
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You're right there LBD that you'll get the most out of your lures when you tie the leader directly to them. Damn straight. Every movement of the line and rod translates to the movements in the lure. But of course it's an issue when you want to change your lures regularly. When you start adding split rings, swivels etc. it creates loose points of movement, making it not as effective for working sensitive lures. In the picture below you show multiple loose points of movement; from the split ring to the loop, the swivel to split ring, the swivel itself and the swivel to the thimble, all creating loose points of movement in your connection to the lure. As you state the "standard practice around the world" in using swivels this way is not for the swivel to be an essential twisting part of the connection, but rather for the swivel providing a point for the split ring and leader to attach to. Poppers don't mind swivels too much but sensitive floating stickbaits do, which are the best in my opinion for targeting kingfish. If you run a thimble, a grommet or plastic tubing, there is no real need for a swivel. And if your lure is swimming right; not spinning, there isn't going to be any line twist. So why use it? I was privileged to have a somewhat broken conversation with Konishisan a few years back about connecting topwater lures, where the summation was No Swivel = Good, Swivel = No Good.  |
Posted By: ELEVAR
Date Posted: 11 Sep 2013 at 6:23pm
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mate the offshores are great rods but the ratings are up the wack, the max id cast with mine would be 165 absolute MAX! it works stick baits even as far down to 60g, ideal I find is around 100g, min is an illusion 76 assuming yours is the same.. a bit soft for poppers the 7ft 6 ones, but epic rods for the coin!! zac
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Posted By: PE Pete
Date Posted: 11 Sep 2013 at 6:35pm
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Yeah Zac I'm simply not experienced with the rod but have two charters booked for next month so hope to learn more about my gear & this style of fishing in general. Good to hear an encouraging voice & will update this thread once I have done the charters. Hopefully with good news & maybe some pics. Cheers Pete ------------- Tight lines PE Pete |