I have been using the AG chain knot....After seeing how Kenji rigs his own.

Any preferences here, crimps, knots, thimbles, armour etc... Post up a photo of your rigging for all to have a squiz.

I am looking for a reliable connection for light leaders also 50lb say...

One thing he does do is connect a Gamma straight to the lure and a blue fish he often uses a swivel and split ring set up.

Myself i always use a knot straight to the swivel and mainly use a uni knot same as kaveman. I think it is best to retie every time you chnage lure, on the days when we have caught huge numbers of fish i have busted a few off on the leader and it is mainly when people use a split ring to change the lures. I feel the line and knots get stretched and fatigue sets in causing perfectly good knots to fail when they normally would hold.

 

Thanks, both are new knots to me so will give them a go...so true about the AG sucking up leader, its a great knot tho.

KM, I will try everything else under the sun first and then come back to the UNI... The KISS principle is always the best.

I have felt the pain all too much lately fishing the split ring change out method...Hence the thread 

Konishi San tied that knot at YEEHAA, he explained it helped to "tame" the lures action...He may have been implying it would make it easier to fish for Joe Blogs (me).

So if you were fishing a Gamma you would have - lure, split ring, swivel, leader?

I could see how a fixed knot at the tow piont eye would effect the lure, the lure would have to "swim the leader"...

No I haven't been but will be, I have some hollow dacron somewhere so will try it out. I think ginga has the right approach, proven knot and re-tie...

 

So what are you using to protect the connection and how do you use it? 

split ring,solid ring,plastic tubing,crimp.

some options to try.Both allow you to change stick baits.Give it a go

Strarted out with: leader - thimble - swivel - split ring then have since done tied direct to lure,tied to swivel and on the weekend was leader - thimble - solid ring - split ring.

 

I think if you tie direct in leaders 120lb or less that you should loop through the lure eye or swivel twice.I know Stella Jagger has had one slice through tied direct,I think some lures get a burr on the eye somehow?

Im using 100lb supple at the momment and have not had any problems with the bottom or conections.

 

Andrew, I personally don't think a swivel is necessary... Some may go down the "line twist" track but who has had line twist problems with their casting braid? More a mono problem...

Many lures don't have a swivel at the belly hook.

Again if your lure spins whilst fishing, throw it away... and watch your lure during a cast, it doesn't really spin at all, so maybe a swivel would be good if casting at saltwater crocs...

I do agree about "doubling" through the eye twice...have had a chain knot clean sliced on a single loop.

The eye on the lure has small "crinkles" from when the eye loop is bent, the inside of the wire compresses while the outside of the bend stretches...

How did you get on with the leader-thimble-solid ring-split ring combo?

That is essentially what you use to jig....i was thinking of using my 7 foot rod to cast sticks and then change over to a jig,Convenient for sure,But then people recommend a swivel if you spin jig

I dont see the need for a swivel to spin jig either as braid doesnt get twist like mono.

                Had thought about split ring onto leader loop with tubing and crimp...can change sticks then.Hmmmmmm

 

No problems with any connections yet,either way.I have seen a photo somewhere of some Asian anglers casting for bluefin with a crimped loop and bite leader...Infact I'm sure it was Mr Konishi but will have to dig it out to confirm.  

Split rings are attractive for the easier re -rig. Personally haven't used swivels cause dont think there is much point.

Would use a short bite leader in the hotter climes though.

2.....160 pound hooker flouro(1.1mm)(80% flouro and 20 % mono) and two 1.2 mm Crimps

both with plastic tubing as below.

Looks good a? Pulled with everything i had and to my horror both disintergrated! Dont know if my crimping sucks or what...the first one with Black magic...thought maybe the line might be a bit old but the hooker stuff is new..

The swivel would have a smooth surface compared to the stick eye...so i will either do the swivel/split ring or Falcos way(split ring/solid ring/thimble) but with a uni knot and change after a few or good fish.

Another variable if kingi rolling around.NT 3 Swivel.9 mm split ring.Gave this heaps and it wasnt going anywhere

The photos are not mine and are pulled off another forum..Im sure the fishing community it came from wont mind.

They (Mr Konishi and others) were targeting (testing lures and rods) BFT

 

 

 

This is basically the system I use without the bite leader.I have found some baits swim better when tied direct though and some much better with a swivel,but generally Im crimping to a solid ring.

 

Edit: Im sure Braid to first leader section will be an FG. 

Mr Konishi San has used a few different systems when fishing with me but i have never seen him use the above one when fishing for kings. The first few visits he done with me he was simply tying direct to the lure, he was primarily using Gamma lures.

On his second visit he was using a lot of the blue fish lures and using a split ring swivel system.

In the best broken english/ japanese the two of us could muster we had a discusion about the changes from previous visits. The information i got out of these discussions was basically the Gamma works at its peak when tied directly to the lure, the blue fish is a more forgiving lure and works well with a split ring system.

 

So far on the days when i manage to get a fish in myself, which is now rare i have found the gamma does perform better tied direct. One thing for certain is the gamma is going to be one of the most difficult lures you are ever likely to swim but get it right and it will be your number one stick bait. So if they are difficult then anything which helps (tying direct) is going to help you out a bit, thats my thoguhts anyway.

Lots of anglers are coming over and fishing the split ring swivel system and it does work well especially if you want to change lures many times during the day.

But things to be aware of are- split ring fatigue, these things will stretch out especially the cheap ones and wiht a bit of pressure in the wrong direction they will straighten out, i have seen it many times jigging with cheaper split rings where the fish comes up and the jig is simply gone. This is not what you want with an expensive stick bait.

The other thiong to watch is leader fatigue, if you can see fatigue on your leader then it is already to late, time to cut off and start again. On some of the big days we have had where huge numbers of fish are caught i have seen a pattern where eventually we will get some break offs on the leader, i feel that the leader is getting stretched out over the day and knots that have held up fine during the whole day will just break with very little pressure.

No syestem will be perfect for every application, i like to experiement and try different things. Jon is on the right track by actually testing his systems. Good bit of discussion here i reckon.

 

 

And thoguhts on their merit?

 

 

I started out using twistes when I borrowed one of Cams' reels set up this way.

I think my casting is better without them now and also I found while they were fine for popper's on smaller stickbaits the leader was coiling in the water at the end of each sweep,so affected the action and created slack line in the water momenterally.

Twisties are a strong connection that give confidence,but since I have mastered the FG I have 100% faith in its strength,so see no benefit of a bimini twist to twisted leader.

If the terrain was really craggy I would go up in leader size,and for toothy critters a heavier tougher bite leader can still be used.

 

I tied some when I went to Samoa but didnt use them,just went to heavier mono or fluro instead.

 

I think they are a good tool in the topwater arsenal but I havent fount the need for them here on kings.

Thanks for that reece...my crimping did suck bit of a prob that my crimps go 1.0,1.2,1.4 etc and the line is 1.1 ...doesnt make me feel good about the crimp.

I have always used the uni/thimble/solid ring for jigging and it hasnt let me down and it doesnt use up much leader(but then i use long leaders)...with sticks the leader is short and certainly an issue is how much line is used up for the join.otherwise,you end up tying another leader too often.

I will go chain knot for jigging and the uni/thimble/solid ring for sticks.Change the knot after a few good fish or a monster.

Can you stick a pic up of how you do your crimp please mate...I will go and practise it and then test 107 kg of LBD on it...the perfect test for any join

Mark, personally I haven't used or bothered to tie one... From what I understand they somewhat have a shock absorbing effect, but one would think the rod is the more affective absorber?

The more I think about it the more silly it seems, mostly when you see a twisty used then a single strand bite leader usually fluro??...why not as Andrew stated step up the leader size for the toothy's and abrasion qualities.

 

I still use a 2.5m 100lb twisty with a .6m 200 FC bite leader on my 130lb popping combo, they are a slick caster for '200lb' leader with no bulk and I feel confident when pulling big fish in the shallows, I don' rate the shock absorption factor at all. I have caught GT's on stickbaits with them but am weary of the 'flash' factor below the surface, obviously popping is no Problem. 

Like Falco I prefer a FG Mono combo for anything up to 150lb leader.

Oh!! and the loop to loop connection comes into it's own if rigging on a boat with no spare rigged spools.