it looks like the creeps want to put the 10% all in the AK area, how they can justify having so many i don't know, maybe because most of its not them at all but other interested groups who think they can somehow make money outa having a reserve where they can take divers, and glass bottom boats to rip people off.........

unless we gets off our ass and we show this is just going too far then they are going to walk all over us.......

as for me im going to paint my boat with invisable paint and keep fishing where i want, so they can all go to hell..........

There's a red dot by Bean rock ?? or is that the Rangi channel they're targeting ? and just out of interest what is the significance of the one in the firth of Thames ?? do they read this site and find out where all the hot fishing spots are and then "red dot" it just to throw the red herring ?? 

I guess what I'm asking is, what site identification system do they have, ie, the significance of this site is ....blah blah blah and needs to be protected.

KF si, Kerren,

                   Is that the kind of question Emma Rush can/will answer ?? if not she's a waste of time and effort and we need to look elsewhere for clarification, and yeah Kerren, where did you get this map ?

Cheers

AC

AC...

Dr. Flor Anthoni of Sea Friends (good guys) emailed it out to several hundred people, so I guess everyone here deserves to see what they have planned.

Even if Emma isn't qualified to answer questions, she will be forced to use up resource when faced with requests for information....they are spreading "us" thin...and as they say each action has an equal and opposite reaction.

Make sure you point out that you are concerend by the lack of consultation shown by DoC and you are unhappy for your tax $$$'s to be utilised in such fashion.

Yeah whats up with the bottom of the Firth, I know there is a bird santury down there, but when the tide goes out there is no water to fish in??, whats up with the middle of the manukau, once again there is only mud. They also wan't the clevdon flats ( as I read the map) as well, what is there a few snapper in summer time and a few bronzies, I just don't understand what exeacty they are trying to protect.

KFsi, I like that boat Idea.

Wefaknis

Yep,

      Fair comment Kerren,

KFSi, what was the content and direction of your Email to to Emma Rush ?? Don't want to double up but I don't want to waste time either.

I'm generally a layed back type, I don't blow much smoke either. If I am going to make a submission then it will count.

Cheers

AC

It's a bit of a concern alright.

Cheers

AC

Hey KingfishSi, Tiri is not DOC's proposal, it is NZ Underwater's.

So lads, it turns out that the map we just all got upset about is out of date and of no relevance to the matters at hand.  Nice waste of time.

I also had an email from Emma Rush.

She says what I have been saying - that DOC is working on a PROCESS for selecting reserve areas as a representative network, and they expect there to be a HELL OF A LOT of public consultation.  DOC has the message loud and clear that ad-hoc reserves will not be acceptable dotted all about the countryside.

So, go home tonight, relax.  Have a cold beer.  Think about one reserve at Great Barrier Island, and consider if it would be a good thing or not, in isolation, for that spot to be allowed to recover a bit from being fished. 

Then, don't get all upset about losing the rest of the Hauraki Gulf, it won't happen.  Fill out DOC's questionaire on GBI (or refer to Option 4's excellent website for online access to do that), and send it.  Answer the questions, it's not a submission, it's a questionaire.  Submission periods are planned for a later date.  Then forget about it, you'll have your chance later to express your view more fully later.

When you go to sleep tonight, imagine areas that you wouldn't mind making reserves - if there are any such places.  Think about how YOU would introduce a network of reserves in your area IF YOU HAD TO, encompassing all of the marine habitats, from estuaries, harbours, coast, and deeper areas.  These are the issues you will be asked about at some stage in the not-to-distant future.  Maybe have a read of some stuff about the Oceans policy.  Think about the full range of marine users, and what would work for the fish too.  Don't worry about the 10% for now.  Maybe find some Marine reserves scientific articles and read them right through to the end (Try Bill Ballantine). 

Consider the possibility that it will all work out in the end, that the whole world is not 'Baddies' and that there are actually people just like you working to improve the world and you don't even know what they are doing, or who they are.  Consider the possibility that the info you've based your opinions on is not perfect, and you do not in fact know everything there is to know about the sea.  I hope you are looking forward as much as I am in TAKING PART in a process that does end up selecting marine reserve locations (or other protection).  All we can do at the moment is to look forward to being a part of it, and hopefully we will get the chance soon.

well said Reidfish........ and thanks again for setting everthing straight.....

just go's to show though what would happen if the crazy Birds where in charge now dosn't it..........

but im still not sure about what the NZ Underwater guys were on to either, was this something they truly thought was good for all or just them???? 

Reid...

How can you call "that" chart out of date when Emma (spokesperson for DoC) says it is the 'Conservation Management Strategy for Auckland 1995 - 2005'...it is still 2003 is it not?

You say "and they expect there to be a HELL OF A LOT of public consultation" ...surely you don't believe this crap do you mate?....DoC are not even entertaining the idea of holding forums in Auckland because apprently "they just" turn into a slug fest?....because we don't agree with their proposals and make it known, we are the baddies?....get a life!! Two tiny adverts in the Barrier Bulletin does not constitute good or even marginal consultation in my books.

Doc, NZUA, The Wild West Working Group and all the other groups out there trying to erode my rights, call them what you want Reid, but you and I both know that they have the same modus operandi and receiving instruction and tax payers $$$$s from the so called conservation minister.

OK then,

            Out of date was my first point in a round about way, a red herring perhaps, So the red dots are/were ????????????????? just area's if interest ? to whom and for what.

Cheers

AC

Guys, guys, guys, that map is a dead horse, there is no need to flog it any longer.  You'd be better off using your time to formulate one of your own.

The Grt Barrier reserve idea was first consulted on over a decade ago, all user groups have known about it. Ask NZRC and NZBGFC if they were consulted, and what they said.  They are supposed to represent you, although NZRFC does not seem to be very good at keeping all fishers up to speed with what they are doing - presumably because of the time and cost of doing so.

Everyone has the opportunity to complete the questionaire on it now, and I hope you all have.  You will have the chance to make submissions later.  The whole area is unlikely to become a reserve, it is a scoping out process only at present. 

well shes gonna get an email from me about great barrier then isnt she. dont worry boys i will be polite.

b.m

I told you, it's dead. If you are gong to fight a reserve proposal, at least fight one that is current, where you will be fighting something other than your own imagination.

Actually, if you want to be useful, you could make submissions on this:
http://www.fish.govt.nz/sustainability/management_strategy/index.html">http://www.fish.govt.nz/sustainability/management_strategy/index.html

Hi All,

Just my thought about all this.

I find it difficult to follow whose proposing marine reserves and where.

It would be much easier if we could go to 1 place and see who is proposing reserves and where  instead of hearing about this group and that group applying for a reserve here, there and everywhere.

It seems that this way we(I mean rec.fishers) may see reserves slide in quietly while we are  fighting another group for a reseve elsewhere!!!.

I realise that it would be difficult to slide anything past you lads,BUT, not impossible!.

By the way, I'm not against reserves/parks altogether, I'm from England and have seen what has happened to the fisheries over there.

Just my thoughts.

Paul

Have a nice J.

exactly Paul!....I believe it be a strategic plan to spread the ground troups thin, followed by a classic pincer move if we don't watch our backs.

By having so many "custodians" for want of a better word it becomes hard to know just whom the enemy are.

the battlefields? our collective rights

I am 100% Reidfish is playing the devil's advocate in hope to get us thinking.

Hey Loiner,

                 What fisheries ???..........they dissapeared in the 60's.

I guess thats your point though.

Cheers

AC

Reidfish....... How do we apply for a Area we think, like if this Forum put its head together and nut out some place that would be good for all and not a hassle for too many.....

this would be more constructive and then it would show how we could put something up instead of putting everything down.......  

ive been knocking myself out to see if there was such a place in the Hauraki Gulf.....

Forum Folk tell me what you think of having one here???????????

this is on the Northern side of Waiheke stretches out to 1.3nm on the Eastern side and 1.8nm on the Western side and is 2.4nm across........

it has safe anchoring, reefs all over the place, no direct road to the place and no houses built on the shore line........

Yeah, fantastic start, Lethal. 
Any incorporated society can propose a marine reserve � in Fiordland the Federation of Commercial Fishermen proposed that the northern half of Milford Sound be made a marine reserve, and this was approved in 1993.

I guess a strategy would be to pick areas that are close to where you fish, but not including all of the area you fish.  Choose areas including a range of habitats - Lethal's suggestion is quite a different habitat to the new reserve at the southern side of Waiheke, and as he said, it doe snot have too many houses nearby etc. Consider including as much open seabed as you can, to ensure it is representative of as much of teh Gulf as possible.

Any other ideas? Maybe people could get Lethal to draw their ideas and we could all vote on it?

Well, KingfishSi, in Emma Rush's own words, which you published earlier on this thread:

"DOC has no plans to establish marine reserves in other areas marked on the Auckland CMS map, or in any other areas, in the short to medium term."

Now I know this will prompt some more great Conspiracy theories from you.  I am not interested in wasting my time fighting imagined conspiracies, when I know that the plan is to develop a more extensive network of reserves than this out-dated Map which must be more than 8 years old. I didn't reply because it is a waste of my time. 

Just as Lethal has led the way with some positive thought, you drag us back into backbiting and conspiracy theories. 

Kerren, how do I add an image to this site?

or maybe just the link to a page:

http://www.geocities.com/reidfish/nz523small">www.geocities.com/reidfish/nz523small

1,4,13.....but only if I "had" to Reid, of course this means giving away access rights...how will I and future generations be compensated?

i would put up with 1 and 4 only because i know that would bring the commercial guys into the fight.......

but tell me Reidfish is this how much you would think they are asking for us to give up of the Gulf????????

you know something i just realized we as fisherpersons are the only one that is giving any thing if the commercials give this up then they will be reinbursed with a bigger catch or a money pay out...... and dont tell me the run off fish into the now more depleted areas that are left is going to be good for us........