my smartwave 4200 build
Printed From: The Fishing Website
Category: General Forums
Forum Name: The Boat Shed
Forum Description: Discuss all things boating.
URL: https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=135221
Printed Date: 19 Apr 2024 at 7:26am
Topic: my smartwave 4200 build
Posted By: spin king
Subject: my smartwave 4200 build
Date Posted: 07 Mar 2021 at 4:35pm
|
just a little thread to document my build, I didnt want to pay full dealer price for a new setup so set about buying the bits individually and waiting for deals to pop up. I purchased a hull and got a brilliant deal on the trailer from aakron. then started looking for a motor...... I was originally going to try find a decent 2nd hand one but soon realised that in this market everything is overpriced... I got in touch with every dealer looking for their best price on a 50hp 4 stroke and ended up putting a deposit down on a new mercury. karl at South Auckland marine did me a deal I couldn't refuse and was 2k cheaper then his competitor's! result! motor should be in the country next week after a 2 month wait. pics for thread   
|
Replies:
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 07 Mar 2021 at 4:40pm
I've started shopping for bits and pieces and so far have got a lowerence elite 7 ti2 (cheers to Josh @smart marine for the hookups), endurant battery ,hella led nav lights, hella dual usb cable port, and hella micro battery switch. still haven't bought the most important bits .... the drink holders ; ).  
|
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 07 Mar 2021 at 4:44pm
been thinking of names for this and so far have come up with....  or  a good mate came up with "single use" haha also should be called tight arse because all said and done I'm at 19.4k compared to dealer price of 25 odd k |
Posted By: OneWayTraffic
Date Posted: 07 Mar 2021 at 5:13pm
| That’s a good price. Nothing wrong in saving money. I’m at $15,700 so far for my build. Second hand motor and trailer though and not done yet. |
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 25 Mar 2021 at 8:45pm
**** yes! smashing it |
OneWayTraffic wrote:Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 25 Mar 2021 at 8:49pm
got a call from karl saying my engine had arrived so duly dripped off my boat and got to unbox my motor! ahhh that new motor smell! I have ordered hydrolic steering and nice 5 spoke 12" wheel to fit in next to the binnacle throttle on the console. should have it back by Easter just need to decide on pitch of stainless prop I think the choices are 12 ~14 will likely go 13   
|
Posted By: kitno
Date Posted: 25 Mar 2021 at 10:21pm
|
Awesome little boat coming together ------------- Top 10 finish 2024 Grunter Hunter. |
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 01 Apr 2021 at 8:11pm
picked it up today   will get it out on the water over the weekend for a shake down |
Posted By: Steps
Date Posted: 02 Apr 2021 at 10:40am
|
Good to see these project documented.. incentive and how toos for others just need to decide on pitch of stainless prop I think the choices are 12 ~14 will likely go 13 Couple things here.. 1/ why SS ? its a robust hull that can be used well in shallow waters around rocks etc.. Hit something ,SS has no give (yeah do have the hub etc) and loads up gearbox, power head with sudden shocks. 2/ When props start to deform under loads.. fast hole shot and heavy hulls at speed.. and these are larger diameter so little more prone..We are looking at around 1250kg gross water weight, getting up around the 37 mph.. and even that can only been seen from data numbers, and still insignificant in economy /performance of a general use boat.. But there is the visual bragging rights to those who thing they are in the know of a shiney prop.  Also...I strongly suggest, initially borrow a 2nd hand or a cheap prop in the ball park .. and bottom end of the pitch range on a NEW engine so dont accidentally load it. Get the data off that if is somewhere in the manufactures WoT rpm range. Always sort the slip numbers (grip/ diameter stuff) before doing the pitch. Doing it this (correct) way saves time, effort and significant ($100s) money |
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 02 Apr 2021 at 1:44pm
haha just call me a magpie! love your input and knowledge! I have a 13 ali on it for trial and will take back data to karl for ss prop, he's looking for 5800 rpm at wide open, hull is 750kg motor 113kg I'm 83 kgs wet and fuel rods etc will be 100kg maxxx so 1050kgs normal running, add 85 odd for another person. which will be less than half the usage as I prefer solo fishing karl did suggest that I should stick to ali in case of rocks etc however having owned many small boats over many years I've never hit one yet or grounded |
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 02 Apr 2021 at 2:24pm
 just starting out the electrical install. lowerence elite ti2 flush mounted, dual usb point, micro battery switch on the outside of the centre console so I can lean over and switch from outside the boat. hella led nav lights, will be installing an nmea cable from a small hidden Bluetooth box so I don't need a headunit and can control my phone from the elite ti2 for music, however I genuinely believe that if you need music out fishing your not doing it right! so will be more for raft up partys etc |
Posted By: MATTOO
Date Posted: 02 Apr 2021 at 4:19pm
|
Nice thread. ------------- Just cruising in my now sweetas pimped out Southern 755 HT0! |
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 02 Apr 2021 at 9:45pm
Cheers ! |
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 02 Apr 2021 at 9:48pm
 here's my plan for the battery on off switch |
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 02 Apr 2021 at 9:51pm
   installed eveything just need to wire it all up and mount transducer. |
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 02 Apr 2021 at 9:55pm
here's how I store rods on small boats, tucked up and out of the way! I only micro jig soft bait and topwater fish so I'm always casting and can't stand anything sticking up in the way especially when on to a good fish in shallow water and having to move around the boat to follow the fish  
|
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 03 Apr 2021 at 12:32pm
@steps hull weight is 220kg sorry. |
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 03 Apr 2021 at 12:32pm
| anyone know of a place to weigh this? cheers |
Posted By: OneWayTraffic
Date Posted: 03 Apr 2021 at 2:15pm
|
Any landfill or transfer station will have a weighbridge. Small towns often do it for free, may cost you a tenner in a city. I like the rod holders on the side. One thing I really liked about my SW3500 was the fact I never needed to worry about sealing holes. Big difference to my current build. I do think that you need a way to get water out of the boat. May not be room for a bilge pump but you need something.
|
Posted By: Steps
Date Posted: 03 Apr 2021 at 3:12pm
|
Single axle trailer? You can change the total rpms with the prop diameter without changing the prop, which is why slip is sorted 1st as is pretty well constant between diameter.. thu more cupping , or change the rake will also do so for fine tuning.. and bow high or low. You can weight the total boat weight on the trailer with a tape measure and set of bathroom scales.. thu you have to be accurate with the distance measurements. Bit of old high school maths and physics. Its in several older posts, and have as a note here somewhere.. just got to find it somewhere on the network here ... Still on my desktop from the last time posted it posting as it is. "Hmmm single axle trailer Did you know you can weight the boat (only the boat) on the trailer with bathroom scales? keep the engine tilt as low was possible, but high enough to just clear the ground.. measure all weights in lbs measure All distances in inches 1/Put the sales under the hitch, a length timber long enough to JUST lift the hitch and take the weight on the scales... with trailer level or slightly low at the front. record the weight call it w1 2/ slide the boat back on the trailer about 12" to 20" measure the distance accruately and record it d1.. the accuracy of this measurement is very critical to the end result d1 3/ now with hitch same height record the weight as before You may not be able to move the boat a full 20" as the balance on the trailer may put the hitch up in the air....if so just move back till just have enough weight to measure at the hitch....OR put a known weight on the bow deck.. say a 40L water container full right at the start , before taking 1st weight (W1) OR simply move a lot of stowed gear equipment well forward. Measure this weight w2 4/ now measure the distance from the center where the bit of wood its on the scales to the center of the axle. d2 Boat weight = d2(w1-w2)/d1 If put an extra weight on the bow of the boat, now subtract that weight. Sounds strange.. like stuff like center gravity, weight of trailer etc... If one does the full calculation create the full equation, including these constants and gravity , center of mass and stuff....then compact the equation, all those factors cancel out and one is left with the above equation. Therefore if the constants like trailer weight... which we dont know cancel themselves out then we dont need that information in the 1st place lol Ok yesterday tested a bungy/ nylon rope painter... nylon cause it has a strectch and poly doesnt. Stop the jerk when the boat slides of the keel trailer fast, and comes to a sudden stop at the end of the painter. Nylon ropes where expensive Was in Smart Marine other day and in the bin was a packet nylon painter exact length wanted....and a bundle of 6mm bungy, 3x times the length needed... thu at that stage didnt know how many length would be required. The painter looped on the winch pedestal was about 1.5m beyond the end of the trailer...with it on the bollard, that put the boat about 1m beyond. I looped the bungy 3 times.. each end and in the middle.. this enabled my to have 1 or 2 or 3 lengths to adjust the 'spring'...and about 1m short of the end of the trailer. Then worked cable ties in thru the nylon rope and around the bungy cords, not tight and about every 750mm Testing spring beside the boat in the drive, we could imagine it rolling off then springing back up 1/3 of the way on the trailer... So attached the painter and bungies to the bollard, and to the winch post, hooked the loops up onto the bow rail. Tide was still very low, and to get any depth would have meant dropping the trailer wheels over the end of the concrete...which meant the rear center roller was still a good 3" above the water... Decided to use a double length bungy. And yeah the boat pushed off the winch stop quite easy.. no need to roll back hit the anchors. Came to the end of the bungy just over 3/4 down, dropped nive over the last roller, moved out from the trailer about1/2m and came back in against the center roller nice and held there, even thu the side current turns the stern sideway.. which as turned out was good Un hooked the painter off the winch post, enough stretch to walk around the water , up on the pontoons , flip it over the trailer guide poles and secure the boat at the pontoons. And still have dry feet. Note: the nylon painter is only there just in case a bungy loop fails .. to stop the boat floating off into someone elses And yes realised why ppl dont let the boats down on the winch hook.. or rather, slide off with winch rope on..besides the sudden jerk at the end, stress on winch bushes etc. We thought it thru just before pushing the boat off... Its because you have to walk down to the end of the trailer to un hook it. Its still best to have good winch bushes, lube with none petroleum based oil/ grease, and pull out when parking up. Now for those who want to join, put a loop in a bungy. you cant tie a knot, it will undo, and if not undo will slip as the strains diameter shrink under load. So making a loop..with a good length of tag for a hand hold and loosely put a cable tie around both where you want the loop to end. put the loop over a bollard or similar, and pull as much stretch under the area where the cable tie is , and pull up the cable tie tight as... a 2nd person. Check the loop size. If a little big repeat with the next tie about 5mm from the 1st...3 ties should do it, I use 4. Use tie widths slightly less than the diameter of the bungy." Rem accurate measurements.. |
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 03 Apr 2021 at 7:26pm
|
@steps and @onewaytraffic cheers guys! took it out today for maiden with my little crew and it went like a dream! very happy with the setup!  
|
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 03 Apr 2021 at 7:35pm
|
Posted By: OneWayTraffic
Date Posted: 03 Apr 2021 at 10:28pm
| Cool family pic. You look a little like a Korean dude I knew while teaching over there. He liked the outdoors as well. |
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2021 at 6:51pm
I'm seriously over snapper and found myself in a mass mackerel workup on Mon so took a few for my family and my neighbor. panko bread crumbed them and the whole family loved them! will be on the menu again  
|
Posted By: shaneg
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2021 at 8:05pm
|
That looks yummy. Havenlt tried macks myself .. but will do now. How was the slimy mack in photo, are they good to eat as well, know kingis love them? |
Posted By: Steps
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2021 at 8:08pm
|
Where else in the world can people like us do this stuff..and I dont just mean Covid... pre and post. And I mean the whole build/ thread to its final objective. Now the bad stuff I read not skim stuff, and look at the pic in posts.. there is always some thing that pops up in the background..So going backwards up he thread. 1/ Those jackets have crotch straps stitched in .. we have them for the grandchild.. Do I see maybe one of them not cliped up right? Edit : Nope its the end of the strap that goes around the waist.. all good here's how I store rods on small boats, tucked up and out of the way! I had those.. mounted on the screw that mount the padded side panels to the gunnels. The trouble is several where in the wrong place.. as step in the boat, where lean against with a good fish...etc...So I got a approx 70cm strip double sided Velcro... and put the screws thru that.. its hook one side and fluffy the other. Got another top of the rear bimmini support..secure another 2 SB rods each side there...and lots rod holders..  Edit: yeah those makeral are quite a surprise. It like difference of being raised on watties spaggetti (snapper)...never had the real stuff... then one day you have the real stuff... |
Posted By: Fish Addict
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2021 at 9:23pm
|
Well done with your new rig. A cautionary warning with respect to your method of rod storage. Rigged rods with hooks and lures attached are just waiting to hook up passing legs. Unfortunately I speak from experience in this regard.
|
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2021 at 9:25pm
yeah the slimy went real well! next time I'm going to gut descale crisscross cut salt n pepper it then on the coals! mackerel are eaten in Europe and UK alot and there are many great recipes |
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2021 at 9:28pm
oh no hope it wasn't too bad! the hooks are normally stored tucked under the Velcro, cheers |
Posted By: Fish Addict
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2021 at 9:39pm
The basis of my comment was that it does appear in one of your pics of the rod (in storage mode) that there is a lure attached with a couple of trebles swinging off it. In my case after I had embedded one set of trebles in my leg I managed to drive the other set into my hand during the extraction process. I was sober at the time but wasn't later.
|
Posted By: OneWayTraffic
Date Posted: 06 Apr 2021 at 11:00pm
| I once embedded an 80g salmon ticer into my upper thigh. It popped off on the back cast. Well in past the barb. Ended up cutting it out with my filleting knife so I could walk back to the car. Fun times. It only has to happen once. |
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 07 Apr 2021 at 6:56am
 took a still from a small video looking at how the motor sits, very happy with height |
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 07 Apr 2021 at 6:58am
 note top speed, gave it a blip to see what the top revs were sitting at, this was 5720 fully trimmed up using 17.2lph |
Posted By: OneWayTraffic
Date Posted: 07 Apr 2021 at 10:23pm
| Nothing much wrong with those numbers. It's not a speed boat. 35-40km per hour will get you just about anywhere you want to go. |
Posted By: Steps
Date Posted: 08 Apr 2021 at 9:14am
|
50hp Merc height looks good.. think if changed either way to 'fine tune' you would fall out of that ideal height. Gearbox ratio Please check this 2.33:1 23.4 mph @ (20.3kn) 5720 rpms Thats 23% slip... rather on the high side for WoT Need far more grip, diameter..which will result in a smaller pitch to be midway in manufactures recommenced WoT rpm range at normal boat load. Test something around a 11 pitch and another 1/2" diameter. |
Posted By: Keithal
Date Posted: 08 Apr 2021 at 10:01am
Double check your numbers steps His max speed was 28.4 knots at 5720 |
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 08 Apr 2021 at 10:37am
yeah sorry should've pointed that out better, wot was 28.4 trimmed as far up as poss without feeling that slip and losing rpm |
Posted By: Steps
Date Posted: 08 Apr 2021 at 10:56am
|
Trimmed right up or trimmed to just before porpoising and/ or ventilation? 28.4 kn (32.7mph) @ 5720 2.33 gearbox 13" pitch Diameter unknown Hmmm thats a negative -8.2 something wrong with the data. A negative slip means the boat is going faster than the engine Separate to the above.. I dont have many small boats like this in my data base. Working on a 200 hull constant as a guesstimate puts the total gross weight on the water about 650kg Would t650 kg be ball park correct? |
Posted By: OuttaHere
Date Posted: 08 Apr 2021 at 11:51am
|
Gearbox is 1.83:1 (unless it's a CT?) on that motor so slip ~14%? 220kg hull + 112kg motor + 160kg crew + 20kg fuel = 512kg, ballpark weight probably closer to 600kg all in. |
Posted By: Steps
Date Posted: 09 Apr 2021 at 7:38am
|
600kg plus battery , cables, sounders, fish bins... so 650 seems to be pretty good ball park? I queried the gearbox ratio above...asked to be confirmed. Yes with post 1991 old gearbox 1.83 15% slip which is high for WoT...about another 1/4 to 1/2" increase in diameter and 11 or 12" pitch ... |
Posted By: OuttaHere
Date Posted: 09 Apr 2021 at 1:00pm
Actually their website says 297kg hull weight so who knows? |
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 17 Apr 2021 at 1:41pm
weighed it today 20l of gas, fishing gear, life jackets and no ice beers etc... 750kg bang on!    
|
Posted By: OneWayTraffic
Date Posted: 17 Apr 2021 at 9:06pm
| Allowing 250kg for the trailer, that's about 500kg for boat and motor. |
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 18 Apr 2021 at 7:44am
yep hull is 297kg motor is 113kg battery is 10.3kg fishing gear etc is 25kg fuel is 20l so 20 kg. plus 80kg solo puts it at 545.3kg |
Posted By: Steps
Date Posted: 19 Apr 2021 at 10:05am
|
So all up when did the test WoT how far off is the 650kg total gross weight on the water out by do u recon? Can then enter accurate hull co efficient data into the data base. |
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 19 Apr 2021 at 10:22am
100kg out, total on water weight was 545.3kg |
Posted By: Steps
Date Posted: 20 Apr 2021 at 10:56am
|
Cool.. Im happy with that... The hull has little higher drag co efficient than I expected.. around 15 points lower (48 if dont re calculate for the slip below) And throw in that you have rather a high slip @ WoT 14%.. Ideally would be around the 5% which would give you another 3.5 mph WoT. The corrected increase in slip would give you a 4000 rpms cruise around the 23/24 mph. When you say "....fully trimmed up..." Do you mean the engine is fully trimmed up. \or fully trimmed up for THAT speed...just before ventilation/ bow porpoising? If over trimmed (fully up) that will cause excessive slip. Ideally The motor should be mounted at an angle so one can over trim @ WoT a little. Mine I ventilate just below 1/2 trim.. if was to the book It would not be quite so sensitive at the ventilation point.. In saying that it is a general use boat not a race boat looking for the extra 1/2 a knt This does illustrate just how critical it is to sort slip correctly, espec before sorting pitch. |
Posted By: OneWayTraffic
Date Posted: 20 Apr 2021 at 2:19pm
| One disadvantage of rotomoulded boats is the relatively high drag as they go through the water. Not an issue at moderate speeds. |
Posted By: Steps
Date Posted: 20 Apr 2021 at 6:32pm
|
Another example of one is always learning.. Gone back of data of some smart waves and they also show similar weight bigger than should be. Why would molded boats have a higher hull friction constant? Alloys/ glass are all very similar other than a couple makes of alloy stand out a little. |
Posted By: OneWayTraffic
Date Posted: 20 Apr 2021 at 7:33pm
|
I'm not sure. But it was sure true for mine. It might be that the material has a bit more flex in it. My one also had a bit of fuzz on the plastic. As to the weight issue, that's usually the single biggest thing. The hull material for the SW3500 is 6mm thick with a full foam fill. The 4200 has 9mm I believe, also with foam. All dimensions being equal, plastic bends a lot more easily than wood, glass or Aluminium. The Youngs modulus of stiffness for plastic is about 1GPa. Wood is usually about 12GPa, a typical woven mat glass layup a little less. Aluminium is 69GPa. So the hull needs to be thicker to give similar stiffness. And hence more heavy.
|
Posted By: Kandrew
Date Posted: 20 Apr 2021 at 8:27pm
|
Less torsional rigidity ? |
Posted By: Steps
Date Posted: 21 Apr 2021 at 9:36am
|
How accurate would the 250kg for the trailer be.. that a guesstimate at best? Been doing a bit of rough calc.. even with such diff in drag numbers, and also considering that it is onlt the surface area that is in contact with the water (the stern 1/2 or less @wot) Still not having numbers add up. Which then leaves as far as I can see actual the trailer weight. And also considering how easy it is to lift these when they dont back up easy where you want... and how even larger trailers are reasonably easy to jump.. Have been looking down several boat trailers, manufactures (off shore) and similar seemed consistent around 300 to 400lbs... around 150 to 180kg example here https://www.karavantrailers.com/marine-trailers/boat-trailers" rel="nofollow - https://www.karavantrailers.com/marine-trailers/boat-trailers |
Posted By: FizFisho
Date Posted: 21 Apr 2021 at 12:01pm
|
Been eying up used 4200 hulls, so I could add the centre console myself and potentially a new trailer, saving some cost on a new 4200CC package. The 4200 really handles the water well compared to the 3500imo, pushing the water out. I had the centre console priced and the chillybin seat they use can also be bought from other sites, being a quality US brand. But I just never had a 4200 hull come through at a decent price to make it worthwhile. So Im stoked to read what you have done as its regathered my interest, boat prices fall during winter so Im in no rush but in saying that there is a lot of spearfishing Im not doing without a boat. We trying to fit the build in for under $15k, thats why sourcing a hull cheap was important. There are many ways to get this done. Thanks for posting. |
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 21 Apr 2021 at 1:21pm
| have got a 12 pitch stainless coming which is a slightly smaller diameter |
Posted By: Steps
Date Posted: 22 Apr 2021 at 9:35am
|
Slip is high , need bigger diameter/ grip. Watch trademe...most are over priced never move.. like most of the boats.. |
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 25 Apr 2021 at 8:37am
| took it out yesterday in 15 gusting 20+kts on a short sharp chop heading straight into the wind and was very pleased with its performance, wot skipping across the tops of the waves and very stable in the swell |
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 28 May 2021 at 5:04pm
new stainless prop arrived and installed and youngest approves haha  
|
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 28 May 2021 at 5:05pm
| shiny! |
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 21 Feb 2022 at 10:55pm
|
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 21 Feb 2022 at 11:01pm
took a week off to fish and mess around on the water, stayed the night on my smartwave on a mooring at kawau island with a tarp over the console was a great little adventure. scored a decent kingi on a @kaveman .icro jig  
|
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 21 Feb 2022 at 11:05pm
this summer we have been on the boat most weekends   
|
Posted By: spin king
Date Posted: 21 Feb 2022 at 11:10pm
 
|