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Fad Positions NZ

Printed From: The Fishing Website
Category: Saltwater Fishing
Forum Name: The Work-Up
Forum Description: Game fishing related topics here
URL: https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=132707
Printed Date: 23 Feb 2020 at 10:49am


Topic: Fad Positions NZ
Posted By: MATTOO
Subject: Fad Positions NZ
Date Posted: 15 Jan 2020 at 6:15pm
So the current NZ Fad Positions .....

Are where.....!!!!??

Now I'm a strong believer in there implementation in NZ.
.
So over the winter I raised the subject yet again.
There was some enthusiasm.
There were also some who suggested they may implement some.

So my questions are, did you.

Don't have to tell us your position, but did you, did you consider effectiveness as per marine commercial traffic.
Are they working yet.

Was it challenging to deploy.

What did you use.

You can imagine the benefit this season with a potential increase in yft numbers. The prospect of more Mahi and the opportunities for spearfisherman and cameraman.

This country is so backward in this area re opportunities.

So did you do it, or were you all fluff.

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Just cruising in my now sweetas pimped out Southern 755 HT0!



Replies:
Posted By: Fishb8
Date Posted: 15 Jan 2020 at 7:20pm
If they were deployed, we won't find out here.


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Be yourself; everyone else is already taken


Posted By: MATTOO
Date Posted: 15 Jan 2020 at 7:40pm
Your wrong Fishb8.

This forum provides opportunities that are not public.

It's not fartbase.

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Just cruising in my now sweetas pimped out Southern 755 HT0!


Posted By: Alan L
Date Posted: 15 Jan 2020 at 7:42pm
Mattoo - it is illegal. If they are there you will only find them by stumbling over them. No one is going to own up to one. Imagine the red tape that would follow- Govt pointy head crawling all over you - the end of the world would be just around the corner. Meantime..... they are common place elsewhere - even Govt funded. But NOT HERE.
Alan


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Legasea Legend member


Posted By: MATTOO
Date Posted: 15 Jan 2020 at 9:38pm
Alan, true.

But they would be great to have especially if they were legal.

I'm interested in seeing them legal.

Promoting discussion about there value is my goal.

Because legal or safe as I see it is a priority.

I have been aware of several years of some deployed.

A few I have accidentally come across.
I'd prefer not to come across the accidentally.

I know you believe in there purpose and value.

M

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Just cruising in my now sweetas pimped out Southern 755 HT0!


Posted By: Alan L
Date Posted: 16 Jan 2020 at 9:14am
Totally agree mattoo. I might even confess to having tried that path myself.
I'm not sure how you would go about promoting the idea and who would get them off the ground. Unlike Aus we do not have an organised structure as amateur fishos.
My guess is Gamefish clubs would be the likely route - get a bunch of them to team up and make a push for them.
It has to be do-able - we are prob one of the few countries without them. Just a Q of how hard.
Regards
Alan


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Legasea Legend member


Posted By: pjc
Date Posted: 16 Jan 2020 at 1:33pm
Tasmania vote Liberals and we will give you ramps facilities +FADs   recc fishing is valuable.
https://www.tas.liberal.org.au/sites/default/files/Recreational%20Fishing%20and%20Boating.pdf" rel="nofollow - https://www.tas.liberal.org.au/sites/default/files/Recreational%20Fishing%20and%20Boating.pdf

A MAJORITY LIBERAL GOVERNMENT WILL: • Make it easier to wet a line from the shore with over $2.4 million for new and improved land-based fishing infrastructure; • Invest $2.2 million in better boat and trailer parking; • Install artificial reefs and fish aggregation devices; • Freeze trout fishing licence fees; and • Drive growth in fishing tourism in inland and saltwater fisheries


Why is NZ so against it??


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What Do mean the fish are biting today asked the Boss


Posted By: MATTOO
Date Posted: 16 Jan 2020 at 4:30pm
Thanks Alan and PJC,

The point is raising awareness and demand.

A post like this is a tool much lesser than it was to spread discussion, awareness and eventually demand.

Facebook and Twitter and those tools would be helpful.
I don't use those tools so maybe someone else may.

It's a sound concept that is proven.

As pjc eluded to and there are endless articles from recreational, fishing councils, clubs, commercial and governments around the world who recognise the substantial value.

It's a matter of getting the conversation going here on cloth eared politicians.

Public awareness first.
The proof is easy.
Then the muppets in government.



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Just cruising in my now sweetas pimped out Southern 755 HT0!


Posted By: Catchelot
Date Posted: 16 Jan 2020 at 4:48pm
I reckon going via a Game/Rec Fishing Club is the best way to generate interest and start the ball rolling.

NP Sportfishing club build one and deployed it many moons ago, not sure how long it lasted until the famous Taranaki seas saw its demise.

And then there one west of the north side of the Knights I believe, that probably got taken out by a trawler...

But, as a question WTF has this got to do with the Govt if it is not in a shipping lane?


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"The sea, once it casts its spell, holds one in its net of wonder forever." - Jacques Cousteau


Posted By: Alan L
Date Posted: 16 Jan 2020 at 5:00pm
"But, as a question WTF has this got to do with the Govt if it is not in a shipping lane?"

I suspect the Marine dept - whatever they might be called, would have a view on that.
Thinking about it for our locality (and I have done so - several times) the location is fraught with problems.
Not just container ships - we get cruise liners coming thru, and endless trawlers ploughing the sea floor - day and night. All of it.
Very few places where it may be unscathed apart from the hazard it may present. 
So I suspect it will have a lot to do with the powers that be.
Not sure how it works in Aus/WA - but I guess they are in notified positions. My first hand experience is in Vanuatu. Where things are much more random. They are basically kept secret as much as possible - as few fishing them as possible. They are supposed to be notified to the Maritime/Fisheries Dept - they just never quite get around to providing the co-ords. So they exist as a shipping hazard.
Regards
Alan


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Legasea Legend member


Posted By: MATTOO
Date Posted: 16 Jan 2020 at 5:42pm
Al with respect.

As much as I want them there they are a shipping hazard.

Not just commercial but as a recreational boatie powered and sail I'd like to know there was an encumbrance in the water.

The more transparency as the Aussies do the safer and beneficial to all.

I'm surprised at your response. You would of normally pointed that out to me.

To many "catch of the days " being in your thoughts,,, lol.


M

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Just cruising in my now sweetas pimped out Southern 755 HT0!


Posted By: Alan L
Date Posted: 16 Jan 2020 at 5:51pm
Mattoo - I think you are mis - reading my post. Agree with you.
Alan


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Legasea Legend member


Posted By: MATTOO
Date Posted: 16 Jan 2020 at 6:18pm
Al is Catchelot, you are Alan.

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Just cruising in my now sweetas pimped out Southern 755 HT0!


Posted By: Catchelot
Date Posted: 16 Jan 2020 at 6:22pm
It appears the Ozzy ones are large buoys with trailing bits at a few various depths anchored in deep water with wicked currents on the east coast above Sydney I think.

The one in NP had a large buoy with a flag on top, I don't know what hung or trailed under water.

I don't know anything about about the one off the Knights.

The home made one in 110m off the chicks was about 10m below the surface.

As to shipping/yachts/launches ... all vessels. I have worked on several Navy Hyrdrographic Survey ships, so I have seen chart corrections, up date to mariners charts and so on being created and then distrubuted... which these day will come through with software updates, thus the area on a chart will have a hazard warning drawn around it... but yeah, this is not a fail safe method for some twat driving into it that hasn't planned his navigation properly.




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"The sea, once it casts its spell, holds one in its net of wonder forever." - Jacques Cousteau


Posted By: Catchelot
Date Posted: 16 Jan 2020 at 6:30pm
Speaking of FADs, does anyone know if Queens Buoy actually was one, once?Geek

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"The sea, once it casts its spell, holds one in its net of wonder forever." - Jacques Cousteau


Posted By: Alan L
Date Posted: 16 Jan 2020 at 6:39pm
OK Catchelot. Got it. me Alan.
The other issue is they move around - a lot. A GPS mark is not an accurate location. In Vtu they can be a km off the mark. Sometimes it takes 30 mins of searching to find them - grid search. I have the latest Vtu marine charts and they have Fads marked - but waaay out of date. And most never get registered.
But that would be the only way to do it here. Marked in a zone - maybe 1km wide.
Alan


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Legasea Legend member


Posted By: Catchelot
Date Posted: 16 Jan 2020 at 6:46pm
Something I did not think about mate with respect to the swing radius, but I think the ones in NZ would be less than 200m so lesser of a problem and put in hopefully fishy areas, not where traffic is common.

As and aside, the only thing I think would be advantageous with having Govt support, is if we could make it Recs only, Comms FO.... insert TUI's ...dreams are freeWink


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"The sea, once it casts its spell, holds one in its net of wonder forever." - Jacques Cousteau


Posted By: MATTOO
Date Posted: 16 Jan 2020 at 6:52pm
I like your dreams Al.

Good point Alan, as we have many good depths to deploy for value.

But I'd like to consider recreational priority, then Comms for nz only fish sale no export.

Nz ers to be the sole benefactors.

We must look after us first.

M

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Just cruising in my now sweetas pimped out Southern 755 HT0!


Posted By: Alan L
Date Posted: 16 Jan 2020 at 8:04pm
Well if the gamefish clubs put them in areas of gamefish you may not have much Comm pressure? No quota for billfish, yes Y/f. any quota for mahi?
Trawlers would get no benefit.
Alan


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Legasea Legend member


Posted By: pjc
Date Posted: 16 Jan 2020 at 8:05pm
Here you go.How its done by the Aussies,

https://www.dpi.nsw.gov.au/fishing/recreational/resources/fish-aggregating-devices" rel="nofollow - https://www.dpi.nsw.gov.au/fishing/recreational/resources/fish-aggregating-devices


Has video showing fisheries deploying them,used in warmer months and retrieved in cooler months.


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What Do mean the fish are biting today asked the Boss


Posted By: pjc
Date Posted: 16 Jan 2020 at 8:10pm
Sanford trial 1982

New Zealand New Zealand’s first FAD was moored six miles off the east coast early 1982 by Sanford (Tauranga) Ltd. The design is described as “similar to aggregating rafts already used successfullyin other parts of the Pacific” (ref. D). Catch data indicating its efficiencyare not yet available. 

http://www.fao.org/3/ad963e/ad963e02.pdf" rel="nofollow - http://www.fao.org/3/ad963e/ad963e02.pdf

Page 40


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What Do mean the fish are biting today asked the Boss


Posted By: krow
Date Posted: 16 Jan 2020 at 8:39pm
Old charts had a few on them. 



Posted By: Alan L
Date Posted: 16 Jan 2020 at 9:09pm
Hmm, wonder what process they had to go thru.
I'm guessing back in the 80's the Comms were interested in catching Y/F.
Alan


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Legasea Legend member


Posted By: Fishb8
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2020 at 8:46am
Some of the FADs I've seen are big orange rafts about 6 x 4 metres and pretty easy to see.
A few years ago there was a large plank off the Cavallis. We got several Mahi one day then found it again the next day and did the same again.


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Be yourself; everyone else is already taken


Posted By: Alan L
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2020 at 4:23pm
These are the typical Fads I am used to. Trust me they can be hard to find. Sometimes I have come back without finding them - believing them to be gone. Only to find them a week later. Depends a lot on sea conditions. But you can be 100m away and not see them sometimes. One Fad I fish a lot , I must have 30 GPS marks for. And still have to go hunting for it sometimes.
Regards
Alan


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Legasea Legend member


Posted By: MATTOO
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2020 at 5:39pm
To true Alan,

You are fighting fads on huge depths and sea height changes.
Start recording sea heights to compensate that variability of that huge length of wire..
You should build a picture to gain centre.

They are fabulous tools.

But there not fishermans tools, I like them but as a fisherman. There value for me is a potential fast feed like a takeaway.

Then I'm off hunting to find the fish.

I see value for the charter fleet, but that's a shallow type of fishing, the skippers are then driving a bus.

But it would bring money in if regular catches satisfy the travelling tourist fisherperson.

Certainly dollars in nz pockets.

I'm betwixt and between with fads here and as a fisherman.

Might keep the weekend warriors in one place while the rest can get off hunting with less Queen st traffic.

M

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Just cruising in my now sweetas pimped out Southern 755 HT0!


Posted By: Fish Addict
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2020 at 7:54pm
Originally posted by Alan L Alan L wrote:

These are the typical Fads I am used to. Trust me they can be hard to find. Sometimes I have come back without finding them - believing them to be gone. Only to find them a week later. Depends a lot on sea conditions. But you can be 100m away and not see them sometimes. One Fad I fish a lot , I must have 30 GPS marks for. And still have to go hunting for it sometimes.
Regards
Alan

Out Perth FADs look more like this.



The swing radius arc can be in the order of 600m so they are not always easy to find.  Despite their locations being shown on navigation charts losses due to ship strikes occur most years.  GPS tracking devices are now fitted to assist recovery.


Posted By: MATTOO
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2020 at 9:43pm
I'm grateful and enjoying all your input.

Thanks,

M

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Just cruising in my now sweetas pimped out Southern 755 HT0!


Posted By: Titahi
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2020 at 12:03am
The wave bouy off exmouth alway produces wahoo and mahi-mahi for us... looking forward to fishing the 4 new ones being deployed by Rec fish west in my home grounds...

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"I love standing by the ocean and just knowing what its for"


Posted By: Alan L
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2020 at 7:40am
"But there not fishermans tools, I like them but as a fisherman. There value for me is a potential fast feed like a takeaway.

Then I'm off hunting to find the fish.

I see value for the charter fleet, but that's a shallow type of fishing, the skippers are then driving a bus."

Mattoo - I have to disagree. But on the surface you may seem to be correct. The charter guys use them - but also fish the contours and distances between the Fads. They are a stopping off point for them. For the locals in their open boats and 30-40Hp motors, they are the food/fish source. mainly skippies, with the occaisional mahi or Y/F thrown in. Some of them still using hand lines, but most have a rod of sorts now. 20km out in all sorts of seas.
BUT - don't think the fish just jump on your hook. Waaay wrong. I can spend days trying to catch a mahi sometimes. Sometimes you see the charter guys struggling for ages to catch a skippy (live bait). The point being the things are fished all the time. So the same fish are being fished over all day every day. They go down. I have spent a lot of time trying to figure them out. You have a small window at daybreak when they naturally want to feed. Most charter guys aren't there (but the keen ones - and their punters are). And the village boys will have been fishing the last 1-2 hrs of darkness. So come 8am when the first of the 'other' charters turn up bright and early for a big day of game fishing, the Fad has already been fished for 4-5 hrs. The other window I have found is later in the day - when the charters and village guys have gone home and the Fad has time to settle. Often the only boat there. But don't think it is easy pickings - far from it. The challenge is a real one.
Regards
Alan


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Legasea Legend member


Posted By: Fishb8
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2020 at 5:28pm
Alan - that's why finding a big wrack of seaweed is such a lot of fun. One time we passed seaweed on port side and saw a mahi swim past all the marlin spread and came into one of Uncle's MacSkippy lure at the short starboard corner. They musy have phenomenal eyesight.

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Be yourself; everyone else is already taken


Posted By: MATTOO
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2020 at 5:40pm
You gotta love flotsam.

We had a wooden door floating off the west coast a few years ago. Had quite a bit of barnacles and other life attached and seaborne.
It had numerous small Mahi and baby kings.

Was a hilarious bit of fun.

I can't resist the casting opportunities when I discover flotsam of any kind in nz summers.

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Just cruising in my now sweetas pimped out Southern 755 HT0!


Posted By: Alan L
Date Posted: 18 Jan 2020 at 6:39pm
Stuff like that is a compulsory check out. Better than a 'Fad'. Why?? Because it hasn't been fished to.
Fishb8- totally agree. They survive on their eyesight. 
I have spent over 1000 hrs fishing Fads. Here is what I have concluded.
They are no easy pickings when fished all the time. A total challenge - in varied forms - depending on species. One which I totally enjoy. Has occupied me for yrs now trying to figure them out. The one advantage is the fish come to you. Saves heaps on fuel. But you still have to catch them. Countless days spent watching the charter guys leave empty -handed, while I have a fish in the bin. But I have time on my side. I have fished in the dark hrs before daylight - bouncing in 2 m sea, unknown location of Fad, or number or location of banana boats I'm with - they have no lights.
So look at it from the fish eyes. Stuff being dragged overhead for endless hrs every day. It is an energy equation for them. Get it wrong - they die. They simply cannot afford to go chasing everything that gets dragged by them. They can't eat plastic and live. So their eyesight is critical. But also I am sure they simply shut down for periods - go doggo. I'm sure trout fisherman get this one.
So you have to wait. And then...... stealth is still everything.
Which is why flotsam is so worthwhile - a new experience for you and the fish. Good odds for you.
No sure thing Mattoo ... not by a long shot. But a great challenge and a better way to spend a day, and the next and.. I cannot think of. And sometimes you get to eat the rewards.
Alan 


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Legasea Legend member


Posted By: Alan L
Date Posted: 20 Jan 2020 at 12:50pm
Just for a bit of interest, and a report of how Fads may (not ) fish , I have copied a email rec'd today from a mate in Vtu. Ocean Blue are the biggest charter group in Vtu (4 boats) and generally are the ones organising/dropping Fads. They fish them all the time - multiple boats, each day. They are no dead cert, by a long way. Most of the luck guys have had in NZ with fads will be largely due to the fact very few will know where they are or fish them.
Regards
Alan
 I saw some birds just north of where we were fishing so put some skippy lures out. I had 3 out and one was a $4.00 pink squid that was on special at rebel sports. I had it on one of my small rods with the $19-99 spinning reel. I think it got maybe 12 or 15 lb on it. Next thing I am fighting a good sized sail fish. I wish you had been on the boat to drive for me today. I was barking orders to the first mate but she just not used to how the boat works. At one point I could see the bottom of the bail but we chased line down about half a dozen times and she was starting to get the hang of it. I knew what I needed to do but couldn`t explain to my 2IC and she panicked a bit. I had him tired out after about ¾ of an hour and had him within 10 metres or so from the boat. That’s when he went under the boat and Captain M turned the boat the wrong way and I lost him. It was a good day out and we had some fun anyway. I wish you could have been there.

 

Kerrys here at the moment so we are going to take 2 boats out to the fads next week and try and cover the field as far as lures go. All that is being caught at the moment out there is small YF. They are all about 5 to 8 kg but nothing bigger. Even ocean blue have been coming back empty handed. Kerry said they have even tried to get some punters to rebook later on because the fishing  is so bad. 




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Legasea Legend member



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