Tauranga Harbour Eagles
Printed From: The Fishing Website
Category: Saltwater Fishing
Forum Name: Saltwater Flyflingers
Forum Description: A forum for saltwater fly fishing enthusiasts
URL: https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=132094
Printed Date: 19 Apr 2024 at 12:36pm
Topic: Tauranga Harbour Eagles
Posted By: Mudfish marquand
Subject: Tauranga Harbour Eagles
Date Posted: 14 Oct 2019 at 4:50pm
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Over the past month or so, I have noticed a big drop off in the number of eagle rays that I have been seeing on the flats. Previously, in a day I would see tens, some days 60 to 80 or more. Recently, I have been seeing one or two per day, some days none. I thought it may be disease or an ecosystem issue. Today I was told that one of the commercial drag netting operations has found a market for eagles and they are worth ....... well the figure mentioned to me was around $80.00 each. (cont.) ------------- On the fly or not interested. |
Replies:
Posted By: Mudfish marquand
Date Posted: 14 Oct 2019 at 4:59pm
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It seems that the harbour ecosystem is open to plunder and if a market is found for any resource, it will be raped by a few for their financial benefit. To a lot of fisherman, eagles are a nuisance that they would be happy without, however an effect on one species will have an effect on others. I guess that eagle rays are not part of the QMS, so the rape of this species and others such as parore is without boundaries. I do not know if they are also targetting short tail and long tail stingrays as well. So is it a coincidence as to why I am not seeing eagles in previous numbers? Perhaps, perhaps not. Cheers ------------- On the fly or not interested. |
Posted By: FishMan
Date Posted: 14 Oct 2019 at 5:21pm
Bloody hell!  Nothing is sacred But wait until the greenies hear about this- eagle rays are a major dietary component of some 'tribes' of orca in the northern half of the country. It will not take much pressure on eagle rays for the orca to starve.An article I pulled off FB today detailed the movement to remove existing dams on the Snake River (Pacific Northwest of United States) in order to restore salmon runs and in part to stop orca families in the adjacent ocean from dying of starvation. The orca there are heavily dependent on salmon. With salmon numbers massively reduced the orca are said to be dying of starvation. I wonder if DOC are going to do nothing when the same happens in New Zealand because of the exploitation of eagle rays? 
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Posted By: Mudfish marquand
Date Posted: 14 Oct 2019 at 5:56pm
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Maybe I don't know how to cook an eagle. I had forgotten what they taste like until a couple of years ago. My son brought a wing home from an eagle that had been caught accidentally in a set net. I cooked some of the meat up an as soon as I put some in my mouth, I remembered the taste from 60 years previously. Cheers ------------- On the fly or not interested. |
Posted By: cirrus
Date Posted: 14 Oct 2019 at 6:24pm
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Any idea who is paying $ 80 for a single Eagle Ray. Had recently seen for first time ever "Skate wings "in N.W. Could these be Eagle Rays,misnamed. Eagle rays are a highly regarded small game fish in many countries.. Trevelly and Kahawai exported at virtually cost and now Eagle Rays. When will they leave our fish,yes our fish,alone. |
Posted By: Mudfish marquand
Date Posted: 14 Oct 2019 at 6:35pm
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I have no idea where the rays are ending up cirrus and probably won't find out now that I have fired this up. I have always felt that our harbours should be closed to commercial fishing, left as breeding areas and without the pressures of commercial fishing. I have a meeting with a ray researcher tomorrow so who knows what will happen. Cheers ------------- On the fly or not interested. |
Posted By: MB
Date Posted: 14 Oct 2019 at 8:01pm
| Ray wings can be used as a substitute in shark fin soup. Given the price quoted, maybe that's where they are ending up? Even if that isn't they case, I'm not entirely surprised - see my recent thread about Auckland Fish Market. |
Posted By: Mudfish marquand
Date Posted: 14 Oct 2019 at 9:01pm
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Point taken MightyBoosh, I hadn't thought of that. The price per eagle may also be dependant on weight too, some of the black eagles I come across are big fish. If there is a market for eagles, perhaps there is also a market for long tail and short tail stingrays. Cheers ------------- On the fly or not interested. |
Posted By: Fraser Hocks
Date Posted: 15 Oct 2019 at 10:35am
Holly hell. The estuaries being used by commercials is wrong in so many ways in the first place. I noticed what I though was a reasonable size commercial fishery in the harbor a few years ago when I was there. I though it was a disgrace, but some told me I was wrong  Now they are targeting rays as well? Talk about pooping in your own back yard. A sure fire way to decimate a fishery. If I were you guys, id be lobbying to get all commercial fishers out of the harbor, with maybe an exclusion zone around the entrances. Estuaries are the womb of a fishery. Kill that and it many never recover.  When I lived in Australia I sat on the board of RecfishWest and we did the same for commercial netting of kahawai. Took about 3 years to make a real impact, and I hear that now the stocks are thriving once again.
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Posted By: Fraser Hocks
Date Posted: 15 Oct 2019 at 10:38am
| Remember guys, as JFK said "The Only Thing Necessary for the Triumph of Evil is that Good Men Do Nothing" |
Posted By: Mudfish marquand
Date Posted: 15 Oct 2019 at 1:22pm
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I'm not sure what is going on, it could be coincidental that I am seeing few rays at the same time there is commercial fishing for the rays. Usually at this time of the year, the ray numbers are lower than what I am used to seeing. If there is a market for rays, and if it is for the shark fin market, there is a possibility that ray numbers could dive substantially. Put a $ value on any animal, fish or whatever and there are people out there ready to make the money. I am told that the rays are very important to the harbour because they dig the surface of the seabed and turn it over. ------------- On the fly or not interested. |
Posted By: Mudfish marquand
Date Posted: 15 Oct 2019 at 1:29pm
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We need to know how many rays have been taken, if this is a fishery that is likely to be developed, and if so, what effect could it have on the eagle ray population and the harbour ecosystem in general. At the moment, I don't know the figures. If the rays are used for shark fin soup, short tail and long tail stingrays are probably being sought as well. Just seems to me that nothing is sacred. I am told that the vast majority of the rays in the harbour are females. ------------- On the fly or not interested. |
Posted By: FISHBYFLY
Date Posted: 18 Oct 2019 at 8:27pm
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Learn anything from your meeting with 'researcher' Dick? Cheers, Adam ------------- By Fly, Nothing Else,Just Fly |
Posted By: Mudfish marquand
Date Posted: 18 Oct 2019 at 9:50pm
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I met the researcher and was taken seriously. My concerns have been echoed by another marine specialist. At the moment, information is being gathered at a higher level and as soon as I know more, I will report back. Yesterday I waded three kilometres of channel edge and saw only two eagles. Cheers. ------------- On the fly or not interested. |
Posted By: FISHBYFLY
Date Posted: 19 Oct 2019 at 9:30am
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Thanks Dick, look forward to update ------------- By Fly, Nothing Else,Just Fly |
Posted By: Mudfish marquand
Date Posted: 07 Nov 2019 at 5:57am
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Very pleased to report that I have been seeing an increasing number of eagles in the last ten days. Have not seen the commercial guys recently on the harbour. Haven't heard anything more about what's going on. Quite surprising how many eagles I see with no tails. Cheers ------------- On the fly or not interested. |
Posted By: Fishinmad1
Date Posted: 07 Nov 2019 at 7:49pm
| That’s because losers cut them of, someone should cut the p@$&s of and see how they like it, better still cut of one of their hands preferably the one they toss with. |
Posted By: Fishinmad1
Date Posted: 07 Nov 2019 at 7:55pm
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I like catching eagles they like to do their Arials and a good workout for your gear and knot tying abilities. Easy enough to unhook just flip on their backs and pop the hook out job done. |
Posted By: Mudfish marquand
Date Posted: 07 Nov 2019 at 8:53pm
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Yeah, eagles are pretty cool. The vast majority are quite shy but I have managed to get close to several and watched them using their snout for digging. If you see eagles feeding, it's worth putting a fly into the dust trail and you have a good chance at picking up a kahawai. I have targeted kahawai successfully on fly by doing this. I have seen and caught kahawai riding eagles (as well as riding short tails) and once caught a small king that I watched riding an eagle. I have seen very small fish riding eagles just ahead of the snout but I am unsure as to the species, perhaps very small kahawai. A guy from the University of Waikato suggested they could be juvenile warehou. All very interesting. Cheers ------------- On the fly or not interested. |
Posted By: Mudfish marquand
Date Posted: 07 Nov 2019 at 9:07pm
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A few years ago, I was wading the flats with Miles R. at the start of the incoming and we saw 60 or 70 eagles go past us travelling with the tide. About a third of the eagles were each carrying three or four small riders. The dead calm was suddenly shattered by explosive splashes the full length of the shallow channel the eagles were travelling on. I didn't know what was going on, but Miles R. twigged immediately, and it all made sense. A mob of kings came across the eagles and small riders, and wanted breakfast. The commotion panicked the eagles and they ended up spooking each other the full length of the channel like a Mexican wave. The eagles just exploded in a roar of white water. Witnessing such an event is what makes wading the flats so fantastic. You don't need to catch fish every time. Cheers ------------- On the fly or not interested. |
Posted By: FISHBYFLY
Date Posted: 08 Nov 2019 at 5:38pm
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Nice story, thanks for sharing. heres a question, a couple of spots i pest around are home to those huge black rays, has anyone witnessed rider s on that species. i tryed to narrow down there specs in 'Coastal Fishes of NZ'[Malcolm Francis] But im not sure, thinking they might be large shorttails or large longtails. thing is there so broad[almost circular] and slow moving,unlike shorts, longs etc. Cher. ------------- By Fly, Nothing Else,Just Fly |
Posted By: Mudfish marquand
Date Posted: 08 Nov 2019 at 7:26pm
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Hi FISHBYFLY. Just the two species of stingray in our estuaries. The short tail stingray and the long tail stingray. I have seen both species carrying riders. Both are a similar shape and colour, but the best way of telling them apart is by the length of the tail. The short tail as it's name suggests, has a short stumpy and powerful tail that can have up to three long barbs. When threatened, it will lift the tail over its back and the tail has ample power to drive the barbs through flesh or wader boots. They are inquisitive and sometimes won't yield. The long tail stingray has a long whip like tail. Easy to tell them apart when they are close. Cheers ------------- On the fly or not interested. |
Posted By: Mudfish marquand
Date Posted: 08 Nov 2019 at 7:31pm
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Eagle rays are a completely separate species of ray and not related closely to stingrays. Their method of propulsion is different and they have pointed wings instead of the stingrays' circular disc. You would have to be unlucky or bloody careless to get barbed by this species. Cheers ------------- On the fly or not interested. |
Posted By: FishMan
Date Posted: 08 Nov 2019 at 8:42pm
| Yep, I'm thinking you're looking at large short-tail rays Adam. They can get huge. The most common big ray on the northern east coast. The only places I've seen the long-tail ray in the north has been in west coast harbours. |
Posted By: Mudfish marquand
Date Posted: 08 Nov 2019 at 9:05pm
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We are lucky to get both stingray species in Tauranga Harbour. The largest short tail I have personally seen was a few years ago off Fergusson Park. I reckoned a conservative 2.15 metres across the disc. The species is reputed to grow to over 3.0 metres and weigh over 300 kg. I have caught a big one at Thompson Sound, Fiordland years ago and have seen short tails in Bluff Harbour. I have only seen long tails to around 1.7 metre disc width but they too can get much bigger, but not as big as the short tail. I had one swim quickly up to me and rest a wing up the side of my waders. Two days previously, one did the same to one of my mates at the same location. Cheers ------------- On the fly or not interested. |
Posted By: FISHBYFLY
Date Posted: 09 Nov 2019 at 4:09pm
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thanks for that Dick and Craig, got to be short tails then, huge suckers, must have a few years undertheir belt. its two seperate locations ive seen them, one location has one that arrives at the exact same time of the tide each day, and feeds in same spots, locals recognize it and i think its got a name! ------------- By Fly, Nothing Else,Just Fly |