So after all that, it looks like my main chain is heaps long enough, the spare's a bit short, both anchors are light and both warps are too short.

As money's a bit tight what I thought I'd do is:

- Buy a replacement Danforth and Grapnel of 6.5kg each

- Chop some chain off the main, leaving me 7m on there and keeping 4m as an emergency spare

- Join the two warps together to give 65m. I'll put another rope on board as an emergency spare.

That will allow me to anchor in 14m. A bit short but any deeper and I can drift fish. Eventually I'd buy a 100m nylon warp but I can't afford it right now.

I'd appreciate the opinons of those who've got plenty of experience. I'm based in Palmerston North so going off the sandy shallow beaches round here mainly, and down to Kapiti coast and Welly harbour.

I'll do as you suggest and test what I've got. Another option is joining the existing chain to make 11m or 11kg of chain, which with the two warps (65m) would give me 76m all up. 

Only problem is I wouldn't have any spare chain. Is it better to have one really good setup or a not-so-good one and a spare?

Yep also I'm a beginner so I'll only be out when it's real calm. Of course it could turn to **** but I certainly wouldn't go out planning to anchor in crappy weather. If I get braver I'll just upgrade my hardware.

At some point I will want to do some overnighters tho (believe it or not at 6'1" I can actually sleep in the wee cabin) so need to be confident I'm not going to drift in the night. Again though I can upgrade before doing this.

Another question do you run a release line off the back of the Danforth with a buoy attached? I know they can be a prick to release from using them on nets before.

Thanks, on the coast here around Foxton it's a couple of NM out to 30m depth. I don't know if I'd want to be going further than that in my wee boat, maybe eventually but from what you two have said it should cover my needs for now.

Surely any knot causes a 'lump' when pulling up over the bow?

ps. Hartleys are nice little boats.

 

I use one good warp and a spare anchor (grapple usually use Danforth) and a buoy - the idea of buoy is if anchor gets stuck can tie buoy to line and return later with a bigger boat and pull out, also if an emergency or kingi on line can attach buoy and cast off.

 

Yes I have read about X5 length of warp but not found that much needed I have 120m and anchored in current at 40m with care (let anchor bite then feed out a bit more line and again).

 

Haven't played with release lines - I find when anchor stuck it is stuck usually - main thing is to use grapple when anchoring over rocky bottom.

 

Length of rode (chain and rope) - 5 x depth I believe is for overnight and possibly difficult conditions - its not feasible for most fishing depths. I usually get away with 2-3 times depth.

Thanks Foxtrot Oscar, I hadn't got that far ahead yet to be honest. There is a roller over the bow that handles the chain/warp d-shackle ok but yeah an inline splice would be best. Just no idea how to do them, is it something your average amateur could do?

MacSkipper wrote: I tend to use either or Danforth or grapple depending on bottom as Danforth can get stuck in rocks.   I use one good warp and a spare anchor (grapple usually use Danforth) and a buoy - the idea of buoy is if anchor gets stuck can tie buoy to line and return later with a bigger boat and pull out, also if an emergency or kingi on line can attach buoy and cast off.   Yes I have read about X5 length of warp but not found that much needed I have 120m and anchored in current at 40m with care (let anchor bite then feed out a bit more line and again).   Haven't played with release lines - I find when anchor stuck it is stuck usually - main thing is to use grapple when anchoring over rocky bottom.

Thanks, yes over here on W coast it's mainly sand so will use Danforth, just want the grapple incase I venture somewhere with rock. Will put a buoy on board as you suggest.

Quick silver wrote: I'd think that your backup grapnel would struggle to hold your boat out at from Foxton as its all really sandy. maybe when funds allow replace your main anchor with a new larger danforth and longer warp as in a bit of wind I would think 42m of warp would be struggling in 30m of water and no doubt with a bit more confidence you will be heading out further anyway. Then you will be able to use your current anchor as a backup and a longer warp will get you further away from the noisy anchor chain when your fishing too

That sounds like a good plan thanks. 

Steps wrote: you may find that the small danforth holds fine with that nice long chain anyway. As long as the chain has enough length and weight to keep the drag mainly horizontal i cant see it dragging with a small boat like that.  Agree.. It may 'fail' if anchoring up in rather serious wind/ tide conditions thu... putting that into real life perspective, doubt very much is stupid enough to be out in those conditions, or even 1/2 of them.  As to length.. like others above, most boats around that size very rarely anchor up in much over 30m, and if fishing thats fine. Son had 70m on his 5.5m boat which limited him to around the 50m mark off the west coast fish.  The grapple.. I would not consider or think of it as a "spare anchor".... the only time I use that is when anchoring up real close into rocks .. and I mean real close...to stop the boat swinging onto the rocks as the tide changes or gusty breeze.  I do carry a spare anchor (and chain)....have had to cut one free on a deep pin few years ago...lost 9m chain, and about 30m warp.  Having the spare and 40m warp left meant we could still anchor up over night.. didnt have to head home...And this is where having 70/ 100m of warp works well...pick up another 50m and splice on , u still have a good 70m plus in the locker.  Keep the 9m of chain on the main anchor...  Splice the 9mm off the grapple onto the main warp. Put 40 or 50m of 6mm on the grapple and leave the 2m of chain on the grapple. I do not have chain on the grapple for holding the stern...try throw a grapple with a chain on it....or a 9mm rope. In saying that, Im considering... an excellent video in a rescent thread on landing on rocks and mooring the boat off the rocks.... maybe adding 1m chain, and 10 or 20mm of 8 or 9mm bungy instead.  Just means dropping the grapple 1st from the stern, hooking it, keeping the tension on then drop the main anchor.  A grapple, if that tension comes off, it drops, and there is a good chance it may not 'hook' up the same or at all.

Thanks. Around here I don't even know where I'd encounter rocks close-in, maybe if I went down Kapiti way. I'll do what you suggest with the main anchor and go out a few times and have a play around before I spend any $. Will leave playing with the grapple till I'm more confident handling the boat close in to rocks.

letsgetem wrote: My experience with a 4.4m cuddy cabin boat in Hauraki Gulf  - only anchoring temporarily for fishing (ie not staying overnight), the need for very secure anchoring seems far less. Because, if it doesn't hold, I either let out some more rope, or move. A heavier anchor is harder to pull in.     Length of rode (chain and rope) - 5 x depth I believe is for overnight and possibly difficult conditions - its not feasible for most fishing depths. I usually get away with 2-3 times depth.

That sounds about right. Seems that I'll be OK for now but maybe upgrade if I do start doing overnighters.

Steps wrote: Temp fishing... Drop in 30m water, 2 to 3 times depth.. thats 70 to 90m out...  Not many small day boats under 5.5m have much over 50m...plus chain... and they hook up fine, even in the currents off the bottom of Waiheke on big tides. Reality is lets face it, its generally an inexperienced person dropping the anchor and the skipper on the helm. 1st order, dont throw the bloody think in too fast... keep feeling the weight, dont want the chain to wrap the anchor on the way down 2nd when hits the bottom, feel the weight start to go on, now drop another 4 or 5m....if low tide  then another 3m. A turn around the bollard, and wait for it to load up, give it a few more moments then hitch it off. 30m ends up having 40/ 50m out. Skipper then keeps an eye on landmarks, surrounding boats and gps.  With enough short link anchor chain, more than 9 times out of 10 the boat holds up... and if doesnt it will be because the warp dropped, thrown out too quick and the anchor tangled the chain on the way down.

I've given this some thought, sometimes I'll be out solo other times with a mate who most likely is inexperienced. So you reckon it's best I keep control of the boat and instruct my mate how to drop anchor? No idea about when I'm out on my own, guess it's just one of those things you figure out with practice. My GPS has got an alarm on it too which I'll use while fishing.

Be wary using anything except a grapnel in heavy foul country. If you do use your main anchor a buoyed recovery line tied to the head of the anchor is a good insurance policy. You may still need to do doughnuts in reverse if the chain gets tangled in the foul. 

If you plan to change out your anchor to suit the ground you are anchoring in, use the largest shackle you can (probably a 8mm with 6.5mm chain) & pay attention to getting the shackle pin tight. Mouse it with suitable mousing wire, or the heaviest cable tie you can get through the eye in the pin. If you use a cable tie, carry spares onboard & check it every time you recover the anchor. 

Chain is your friend, and 9m of 6.5mm is more than plenty. It will probably allow you to anchor in water twice as deep as your anchor warp length. I have 20m of the same chain with a 6kg Rocna on a 6m hardtop, & the anchor holds under most conditions in 60m with only 70m of warp out. 

Your spare anchor/warp/chain will seldom be used, and probably won't be suitable as an emergency anchor unless it has similar capabilities as your main anchor. If you find yourself using it because your main anchor has dragged or been lost, its probably time to go home. Your current Danforth or grapnel may well work fine as a kedge to stop excessive swinging or as a beach anchor for picnic runs ashore. As a kedge it won't be subject to the same amount of strain as your main anchor, but keep a few metres of chain on to help it set and for chafe protection.

If you join the 2 warps together, a proper long splice would be ideal, but a short splice will work fine, and if you taper the final tucks it will run through a 6/8mm winch gypsy ok (if you happen to have an anchor winch) or a buoyed recovery clip if you use one. Splicing is pretty straight forward - Youtube have plenty of tutorials on long/short/eye splicing.

Don't go ott on the size if you buy a new grapnel - they work on a different principal to a dig-in type anchor. With plenty of chain your current one may well work fine in heavy foul. 

Different diameters and types (Nylon - Tight & Loose weave, manilla fibre, Polyester,  Sisal, etc) All are different to work with.

If you're trying to fish on a patch of foul/reef in 30m and you put down 150m of warp you'll swing off the spot in a heartbeat. When we're fishing in 30m we use about 40m of warp and 6m of chain on a 4.5m boat. More warp if there's a current running - flatter angle = less chance of dragging.

On a small boat over a soft bottom you don't need a whole lot of anchor, although sub-2kg does seem light - with lots of good chain, like you have, it will keep the pull on the anchor very horizontal and help it to dig in.

As for the grapnel anchor, don't think of it as a "spare", it won't hold you worth a damn on a soft bottom. It's there for anchoring over heavy foul, likewise the short chain is to prevent getting hung up on a rock.

They're extra safe if you do it properly and attach by the bottom eye then ziptie the chain to the top of the shank.

I got a Kewene stuck once . I tied it off to a buoy and went back and got it the next day, easy as.

 

Steps is 100% right about dropping the anchor down slowly. We watched a boat the other day, motoring with the tide he cut the engine, stood up and literally threw the anchor out He drifted about 200m or more before it caught up on something and he stopped drifting. Easy way to get it stuck too.

Personally prefer the Kewene over the danforth.

I go overkill with anchor weights and chain because when I dive with my brother and no one is left onboard I like to know the boat will not move. 

If you find your breaking them, simply keep adding more until anchor/chain holds.....hardly rocket science

If/when your down Welly ways i've got bit of a selection of danforths found diving, your welcome to take one for some beers or woteva, just pm me a bit in advance

I admit I was a bit dubious about being able to pull one of those off but with the help of http://www.animatedknots.com/" rel="nofollow - Grog  I did a passable splice. It's satisfying to learn new stuff, thanks for that. Will practice on eye loops next.

Point taken, I will change my thinking. I imagine I'll be using the Danforth mainly on the sandy west coast but if I head further south I'll put the grapnel on.

Excellent point, yes I will do this. I plan to go a little larger when funds allow as it is way under recommendations so that would be a good time to investigate the alternatives.

waynorth wrote: Mouse it with suitable mousing wire, or the heaviest cable tie you can get through the eye in the pin.

Done!

waynorth wrote: If you find yourself using it because your main anchor has dragged or been lost, its probably time to go home.

Absolutely. I'll only be going just out of Foxton river mouth initially for a few hours so no drama if I have to go have a beer earlier than planned.

waynorth wrote: Don't go ott on the size if you buy a new grapnel - they work on a different principal to a dig-in type anchor. With plenty of chain your current one may well work fine in heavy foul.

Thanks, I guess no amount of reading will answer that one, will just have to bite the bullet and test it out.