Print Page | Close Window

Your boat ready to slide off the trailer?

Printed From: The Fishing Website
Category: General Forums
Forum Name: The Boat Shed
Forum Description: Discuss all things boating.
URL: https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=122713
Printed Date: 03 Mar 2024 at 7:57pm


Topic: Your boat ready to slide off the trailer?
Posted By: Steps
Subject: Your boat ready to slide off the trailer?
Date Posted: 31 Dec 2016 at 6:09pm
At the ramp couple days ago, winding in the boat on busy ramp and just got 1/2 snugger upto the rubber V thingy...
CRACK
The eye in the bow snapped one side out....hooking the shackle on was pointless... so a slow climb up the ramp and to one side....being a ex boy scout.. open the trunk , pull out the heavy tie down, around the front bolard, around the trailer behind the hitch, back up and pull tight... 2 rear tie downs and off safely home.

We have often scoffed at  threads/posts/ pics of boats sliding off , at the ramp and on the roads , unintentionally....but maybe more unjustified that we realise.

 
We have had the boat coming up 5yrs... just before buying it the front tow eye had been replaced on a service....receipts.. I wonder why?
It is a 5.5m glass boat, all up, motor, gear, fuel etc with 3 guys about 1100 kg tops.. so boat on the trailer under 1 ton.
 The eye is (was) 8mm stainless.
When one 'eyes up how it aligns with the hook, as pulls up is factionally high (more loading on the top side, and when pulled into the rubber V pulls almost square down to the hook/ shackle etc.


 From the pic you see there is a substantial area in the break that shows it have been fatigued for a while.... that is scarry

I have replaced with a 10mm...drilled out the top hole, drilled a new hole for the larger span....epoxied and hammered a dowel into the obsolete hole.
 Then pumped marine urethane sealant into the new holes, smeared the new eye shafts and bolted into place.
 With using the top hole, and new bottom, it has lowered the centre 'pull/ loading area of the eye to give better even loading when pulling the boat up AND when shackled, etc on the road.



Replies:
Posted By: smudge
Date Posted: 31 Dec 2016 at 6:56pm
Luicky. \because the weather was perfect for a west coast mission today I spent my time double checking things on the boat. What started out as new bilge, tuna tube and live bait pumps ended up pretty much a full check over of the boat.. Found the fuel hose from the underfloor tank to the filter had almost worn through. Well worth doing the checks. A couple of corroded and loose cable connections in there too.


-------------
Best gurnard fisherman in my street


Posted By: Don18025
Date Posted: 31 Dec 2016 at 9:05pm
Steps, bad luck. it could have been a lot worse if you lost the boat of the trailer.
Yachties have been very aware for sometime that U Bolts have to hold heavy loads when sailing......so the best manufacturers make them to specification.
I have a towing eye on my transom, it has a working load of 6.4 tonnes and a breaking load of 10 tonnes.....
Have a look at these forged SS examples from one manufacturer;
http://marine.wichard.com/fiche-A%7CWICHARD%7C6524-0202030400000000-ME.html





Posted By: MacSkipper
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2017 at 5:26am
Thanks for sharing as quite timely with summer boating and towing - scary alright!

-------------
Good fishing trip nothing breaks, great trip catch fish.


Posted By: Espresso
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2017 at 7:56am
My Kevlar rope snapped with only a small sign of possible wear... aye time to really check things over.


Posted By: corokid
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2017 at 8:52am
Originally posted by Espresso Espresso wrote:

My Kevlar rope snapped with only a small sign of possible wear... aye time to really check things over.
Kevlar weakens from effect of UV that may not be visibly noticeable



Posted By: cirrus
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2017 at 9:17am
You just never know what perils lie beneath that nice shiny metal.

Remember once at the ramp,winching the boat on and the attachment on the bow holding the winch hook carried away under load. The whole lot went flying past my head at speed  with inches to spare and came to rest in the open boot of the station wagon.


Posted By: Steps
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2017 at 9:18am
Steps, bad luck. it could have been a lot worse if you lost the boat of the trailer.

M8 the moment it happened, didnt think "bad luck" was "have the tie down, damn that is real bloody lucky"... as u say could have been far worse or even fatal on the road ..espec this time of yr.


Have a look at these forged SS examples 
 A while back.. old thread..  the hook on the winch rope bent slightly pulling up... was the std round 'off the self' (8mm from memory) hook... Did a little investigation... noticed that the off the shelf Trogen ropes had larger diameter hooks with flat sides... flat sides is a good indication that it is drop forged (fish hooks the same)
 Yet buy a hook without a rope is not forged ????
 
After that, althu have a short as possible doubled safety chain (doubled because it was already long enough to do so ) ... was thinking... having the intial weight basically loaded against the winch bearings is not good for the winch gears, lock, the rope or the bearings... so a short heavy tie down....
 Pull the boat up on the ramp... safety chain on... pull trailer up out of the way of others. Then pull the boat up a little firmer, put the tie down on, pull that up hard, and back the winch off.. not so is fully unloaded.. but enough to take most of the load off the ropes winch etc.
 THEN the stern tie downs put on and up tight.




Posted By: pjc
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2017 at 9:28am
Originally posted by Espresso Espresso wrote:

My Kevlar rope snapped with only a small sign of possible wear... aye time to really check things over.
http://www.explainthatstuff.com/kevlar.html

It's worth noting that Kevlar also has its drawbacks. In particular, although it has very high tensile (pulling) strength, it has very poor compressive strength (resistance to squashing or squeezing). That's why Kevlar isn't used instead of steel as a primary building material in things like  http://www.explainthatstuff.com/howbuildingswork.html" rel="nofollow - buildings http://www.explainthatstuff.com/bridges.html" rel="nofollow - bridges , and other structures where compressive forces are common.


We have replaced most sheets on the yacht with nylon as it can take more compression,but stretches


Posted By: Kevin.S
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2017 at 9:42am
Something worth mentioning is that if you tow a boat on a trailer secured just by the winch / safety chain onto the eye at the front with no other restraint to hold it onto the trailer it could be considered an unsecured load and get you a ticket from a keep cop.  I was warned about this by someone who had got a ticket, presumably more likely with a smaller boat that could bounce on the trailer.

But, as STEPS photo demonstrates, you shouldn't rely on the towing eye as the only thing to hold your boat on the trailer.


Posted By: Steps
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2017 at 11:21am
But, as STEPS photo demonstrates, you shouldn't rely on the towing eye as the only thing to hold your boat on the trailer.

 No but certainly your concept is there

 Actually all that.. the tie down.. the winch and safety chain ALL go to the bow eye...
 If that fails there are 2 tie owns between the stern and trailer that still prevent the boat from moving backwards.

I have often 'shudder at the practice of a tie down across the gunnels.. to hold the boat down in the rear... If the eye fails.. the boat will still slide a substantial distance rear ward... enough to cause serious mis balance, which under fast slowing causes huge handling issues... chain reaction to disaster.
Also using tie own if tightened enough to prevent rear movement creates massive squashing stress on ther hull of the .. puling the gunnel's in and pressure on the guide rollers and hull pressure points

Then there are those tail lighting bar things strapped across the gunnels .. also used to hold the boat down...boat breaks away, they break , boats on the road. Also seen a few yrs ago a boat with one of these, got into a serious sway... not quite jack knife.. lot weight in the boat coming home from holiday.. and to find the trailer light bar seriously cracked

2 tie downs going from the top of the stern, either side of the motor here it is bolted to the stern, down to the rear trailer cross member.... some non keel trailer boats have to have to crawl under to hook up... keel boat trailers the cross member is a few inched back under the hull..


Posted By: MikeAqua
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2017 at 5:38pm
If my bow eye failed during retrieval the boat would slide back off quite quickly.

I keep the bow rope on (attached to a bow cleat at the boat end) and wrapped around the winch post during retrieval.  During retrieval I pull in the slack.  

Once the boat is fully on the trailer I lash it tight.

Up on the flat, I have three tie downs.  Two stern and one bow.  They run from some big well secured cleats to separate tie-down points on the trailer.

I had the tie downs custom made to length and I use PVC lay flat hose as sacrificial layer to guard against chafing.


Posted By: Mr Moritz
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2017 at 6:43pm
Wonder if bow of boat is able to move up and down when being towed.

That would cause lots of fatigue in the eye fitting. 

Just a thought.



Posted By: Olfart
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2017 at 7:50pm
I don't rely on the winch to hold my boat on the trailer.  I have a strong ratchet tie down which clips to the deck bollard and goes over the fairlead and thence around the lifting bar on the winch stanchion.  Ratchet tie downs hold the rear of the boat on each side of the outboard pod.
Expecting the winch mechanism to keep the boat on the trailer is just asking for trouble...





-------------
Semper in excreta sumus, solum profundum variat....





Posted By: Capt Asparagus
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2017 at 8:41pm
I use the winch, no worries, but also have the u-bolt shackled to the second eye. Bit different being on an alli hull though, no way the eye itself could snap.


-------------
It is only my overwhelming natural humility that mars my perfection.

Captain Asparagus, Superhero, Adventurer.


Posted By: Steps
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2017 at 10:18am
If my bow eye failed during retrieval the boat would slide back off quite quickly.
 Yep so would ours but
 Our boat.. on level ground..in the back yard.. to slide back I have to use a big heavy duty tie down attached back on the trailer each side, over the top of the tow eye and winch back....a slight sloe  slides off nice

 Also a load, be it in a truck on a trailer where ever tends to move forward....

Bit different being on an alli hull though, no way the eye itself could snap.
 Ali failures on trailer frames tend to be AROUND welds... because the heat of welding changes the structure of the metal... weakens... so I would tend on the cautious side over time

From above
"We have often scoffed at  threads/posts/ pics of boats sliding off , at the ramp and on the roads , unintentionally....but maybe more unjustified that we realise." 
and at least a couple we have scoffed at.. including a MPI from memory have been ali... just a thought.


  2 good Tie downs on the rear are the way to go thu... holds the boat down, 2x cant move back, and dont stress/ compress the whole boat across the gunnels
 And most important .. when at the ramp.. quick to remove with the prop rag, tilt motor off travel support, (bung in before leaving home.. and launch
 And same on retrieval....no simple clean and quick.. no  bloody P155ing around at a busy ramp.


Posted By: Capt Asparagus
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2017 at 11:54am
Mate, not if you saw how this thing is welded on.... solid is too insufficient a word to use....


-------------
It is only my overwhelming natural humility that mars my perfection.

Captain Asparagus, Superhero, Adventurer.


Posted By: OuttaHere
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2017 at 12:37pm
I do sometimes wonder... with safety chains (both the one from trailer -> drawbar and winch post -> winching eye) how many people are using rated chain and shackles?
Also on a large number of trailers I've seen the safety chain is welded on... there's a reason this isn't permitted on your trailer's drawbar chain any more, welded chain has a tendency to break like a candy-cane under shock loads (like a boat suddenly coming off)


Posted By: Steps
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2017 at 4:52pm
I do sometimes wonder... with safety chains (both the one from trailer -> drawbar and winch post -> winching eye) how many people are using rated chain and shackles?

 Yep Damn good point...
 Fail trailer WoF if have a stainless shackle... even if weight rated... Stainless doesnt like shock.... which is why things like spring shackles, cross member bolts are not allowed to be stainless. So if your WoF guy has passed your trailer WOF with a stainless shackle I would be consented at what else has been let by...
 As to the chain to the boat.. dont quote me on this, from memory that is to do with owners responsibility to have a secure load.. not a WoF issue (???)


Posted By: Big -Dave
Date Posted: 04 Jan 2017 at 9:26pm
I had a hook fail, on the road, safety chain caught it, albeit with a thud as there was some slack. A month later, the kevlar rope broke, right at the hook, yes, where its exposed to the sunlight. I decided to fit an extra eye in the boat, so proceded to pull the old one out, intending to fit it higher, and a new one lower, using one of the original holes for each eye. When i finally managed to get the original out, it was heavily corroded, and the brass(possibly) nuts in the anchor well were crumbling.
Fiberglass boat. It was a rude awakening as to the limits of stainless, i believe some sort of galvanic corrosion was at work, and in typing this i am thinking of the anchor chain lying against the nuts in the well.
Loose screws in the brass keel strip had allowed water in to the keel timber, and bingo, brass plus zinc, plus salt water, you have a battery...

I did fit a turnbuckle to tighten the safety chain on the boat, also holding it tight down to the trailer, preventing bouncing..
I also have noticed the galv shackles corroding rather quickly where they contact the stainless eye. Interesting..

-------------
you can't fix an idiot with duct tape, but it does muffle them for a while...


Posted By: Pcj
Date Posted: 17 Sep 2023 at 6:54am
Yes this thread crossed my mind yesterday when coming home. Wonder,should I fit a second towing eye?1 for the winch and 1 for the saftey chain,(as like most) 1 eye does both, small cost for peace of mind?

Do have a strap around transom pulling on trailer to stop backward movement but strap lets go or eye gives boat,boat on road.Not sure how to explain that to the insurance Co.


-------------
Amateur's built the ark. Professional built the Titanic


Posted By: Kandrew
Date Posted: 17 Sep 2023 at 2:57pm
Originally posted by Pcj Pcj wrote:

Yes this thread crossed my mind yesterday when coming home. Wonder,should I fit a second towing eye?1 for the winch and 1 for the saftey chain,(as like most) 1 eye does both, small cost for peace of mind?

Do have a strap around transom pulling on trailer to stop backward movement but strap lets go or eye gives boat,boat on road.Not sure how to explain that to the insurance Co.
Paul you can just run a ratchet strap from your bollard through the fairlead and down around the trailer drawbar


Posted By: Pcj
Date Posted: 17 Sep 2023 at 3:13pm
Be easy enough to do too Kandrew and if in doubt replace the eye ,easy enough to do too. Might just do that.Thanks

-------------
Amateur's built the ark. Professional built the Titanic



Print Page | Close Window