This is unbelievable
Printed From: The Fishing Website
Category: General Forums
Forum Name: Fisheries Management
Forum Description: Anything to do with fisheries management here please
URL: https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=121221
Printed Date: 30 Jan 2026 at 10:38pm
Topic: This is unbelievable
Posted By: Kevin.S
Subject: This is unbelievable
Date Posted: 19 Sep 2016 at 9:03am
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I've just read this article, and while it is what many have long suspected I never thought I'd hear it from MPI. The Ministry for Primary Industries has admitted that illegal fish dumping is so widespread that if the rules were properly enforced over half of inshore fishers would go out of business. "Fisheries Management can't quantify the tonnages involved but we suspect they are significant to the point that they are impacting on stocks." http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/313631/mpi-official-admits-fish-dumping-widespread
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Replies:
Posted By: Kevin.S
Date Posted: 19 Sep 2016 at 9:05am
| Sorry if this is in the wrong place, wasn't sure if it was news, fisheries management, or other. But this is something that everyone needs to read, only a very short article. |
Posted By: cirrus
Date Posted: 19 Sep 2016 at 9:17am
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Unbelievable but sadly true. Suspect the root cause is lack of respect of everything that is or could be good about this sad country. And from this arises addiction to money at any cost,in this case from our fisheries. Totally surprised MPI even admitted this, as it blows the myth of good fisheries management clean out of the water. Need a strong coffee. |
Posted By: Tagit
Date Posted: 19 Sep 2016 at 9:37am
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So how many times has the Minister or someone from MPI looked the camera in the eye and knowingly lied to our faces in saying that fish dumping was not widespread and not an issue for the management of stocks?? The fear now is that the camera monitoring system is exactly what people are thinking it is and will be held up as 'proof' of good fishing practices for the next 10 years until we dig another email out of MPI under the OIA that tells us how it is really just a publicity stunt to hide the illegal practices being used and how much damage they are doing. By then it may be too late.
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Posted By: cirrus
Date Posted: 19 Sep 2016 at 9:50am
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Agree ,cameras are just a smokescreen . Issue at hand is fish dumping right now,not cameras. Article says boats detected dumping in 2012 were supplying Sanfords,the home of "sustainable seafood". Nothing sustainable about that |
Posted By: MacSkipper
Date Posted: 19 Sep 2016 at 9:52am
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Thanks Kevin I read the article - what concerns me is the spin once again put out after email published, by MPI themselves that it is not that bad and now we monitor so it wont continue to happen (and they are probably having a go at authors of email as we speak to shut them up). I am sorry but I have lost confidence in the "everything is ok" story as we can see that there are less fish around than used to be in highly populated areas. And these stories don't go away but keep coming up. Why was the camera monitoring of fishing fleets delayed for so long and why is it being run by a fishing company? Not a good look  !------------- Good fishing trip nothing breaks, great trip catch fish. |
Posted By: Kevin.S
Date Posted: 19 Sep 2016 at 11:12am
| I have just finished writing to my local MP about this. I encourage everyone who believes that government departments condoning illegal fishing practices is not acceptable do the same. Only if enough of us make it clear that we will not accept this will anything get done, otherwise it will get ignored. |
Posted By: v8-coupe
Date Posted: 19 Sep 2016 at 12:37pm
And if one other poster is correct and they are now incorporating mincers, any evidence of wastage and mortality will be evacuated beneath the boat. No more "visual" evidence. Viola, An efficient new boat with little to no wastage. Will there be a camera pointed directly at the mouth of the mincer? I guess only time will tell. Remember, MPI has been charged by Government with doubling primary exports by the year 2025. If I remember correctly. You can have the most efficient boat in the world. However, you can not catch fish if they are not there. The question then becomes, "how do we get extra from the existing biomass"? We all know the answer. ------------- Legasea Legend Member |
Tagit wrote:Posted By: cirrus
Date Posted: 19 Sep 2016 at 1:10pm
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Why would anyone build new boats to fish a fishery that in some areas is down to around 6% of biomass. That simply is not sound business practice or sense. Suspect a lot is hidden about the purpose of these boats. Is it possible they could also be used for towing nets full of small snapper to holding pens for fattening up. And we all know what they would most likely be fed---fresh anchovies or pilchards. And we also can guess what that would do to the remaining wild fishery , sea mammals ,and bird population. |
Posted By: pjc
Date Posted: 19 Sep 2016 at 1:51pm
| From what I read they are factory type vessels and will only discharge when net not in use.pumps out underwater to stop birds getting caught.but who knows if there will be a monitor or not |
Posted By: v8-coupe
Date Posted: 19 Sep 2016 at 2:04pm
Mmmmm. Once something has gone through the mincer there is absolutely now way of knowing what it was nor how big it was. Will the tonnes put through these mincers be counted in the boats/companies quota? Probably not as there is no proof what the species was. So I suspect it will be a gestimated weight, if allowed for at all, just as the legally allowed for 450 tonnes of mortality/wastage annually is. Spoke to some MPI people at the previous meetings and all agreed the 450 tonnes was an out of date value and all suggested it was on the low side. ------------- Legasea Legend Member |
Posted By: feeder
Date Posted: 19 Sep 2016 at 3:17pm
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Just this weekend I spoke to my neighbour at Kawhia about this wastage, he was a crewman on the trawler Fair Dinkim, long gone from Kawhia, his estimate was around 50% went back over the side, wrong size, wrong species, too many and so on. This has been an industry practise for may years. Not that long ago I put up a post re trawlers on average catch 1 dolphin a week in their trawl nets in snapper 1, was pooh poohed, (this also came from a crewman) not so out the now as I see 2 hectors were reported last week (both died) in trawl nets. Cheers ------------- The only bar to frequent is the Kawhia Bar |
Posted By: herby
Date Posted: 19 Sep 2016 at 3:58pm
When was he fishing? |
Posted By: feeder
Date Posted: 19 Sep 2016 at 4:11pm
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He fished with Alan Langdon (owner) for approx 5 years, mid eightys to early ninetys, he is now 80 years old. Cheers ------------- The only bar to frequent is the Kawhia Bar |
Posted By: pompey
Date Posted: 19 Sep 2016 at 5:31pm
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I would like to see the Maori Party take a real strong stand on this and threaten to withdraw Govt support unless something is done smartly including an over hall and sacking on MPI senior staff and moving the Minister on to something he can handle. These are the issues the Maori Party should be leveraging off as it affects them quite a bit in the long run and would give them a real point of difference. However, I suspect they are part of the problem with their boats dumping too.
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Posted By: Tagit
Date Posted: 19 Sep 2016 at 6:29pm
| It was interesting listening to the radio interview part with the senior guy from MPI. His response to lots of questioning about the truth around dumping was effectively that it was irrelevant because they were going to have cameras now. Note that he didn't deny that dumping was a huge issue, just tried to say that it was irrelevant. That means that every time someone from MPI or the government has previously commented about how dumping was so minor that it wasn't an issue, they were presenting us with deliberate lies. Normally getting caught in a deliberate public lie is a sacking offense for a minister or senior government official, but in this case Mr Key hasn't even entered the discussion. What that suggests is that they are so used to lying about the management of our fisheries that they have forgotten that they are meant to be telling the truth. The even sadder thing is that we are so used to being lied to about our fisheries by the government that no one has raised a serious public voice to get the minister sacked on the back of being exposed by this report. |
Posted By: Otto
Date Posted: 19 Sep 2016 at 6:49pm
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"if the rules were properly enforced over half of inshore fishers would go out of business." Has to be the quote of the year that |
Posted By: widerange
Date Posted: 19 Sep 2016 at 7:46pm
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don't get too sentimental there tagit,"Mr" Key is a shameless liar,frequently caught out. He doesn't care and no one else seems to either. They've(supposedly) been voted in twice now Shouldn't come as any surprise that the team follow the captains' lead. What are you gonna do about it?
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Posted By: cirrus
Date Posted: 19 Sep 2016 at 8:50pm
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So ultimately who gives the right to trash a public fishery. |
Posted By: mowerman
Date Posted: 19 Sep 2016 at 9:21pm
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Once 6 new psh mini super trawlers are operating you can kiss your fish goodbye.l mean your 7 fish.The mincers will hide the evidence of anything they don't want.They will be fishing the areas the Danish scieners are currently. The entire fisheries is a shambles. Many changes are going to be pushed for in your fisheries. Treaty of Waitangi settlement for Ngatiwai.Ngatimanuhiri is in Snap1 This will be earmarked Iwi controls Snap1 This is now being set up under Seachange..Whanu are active in this role already..check your appointed people. This is going on behind closed doors The current Snap1 management plan is part of it ...Any person or group of people who have had input into this plan know The management plan is a smokescreen for what is really in store for us all. Get rid of the Quota system Likewise Mpi out of our fisheries Stop using our fish as an excuse as sustainable..it's not Management of our fisheries is not for money. Nor should it be controlled by the people who are involved in this new mangement plan Don't shoot the messenger!! ------------- The People Protest Actions Speak Louder Than Words |
Posted By: mowerman
Date Posted: 19 Sep 2016 at 10:05pm
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The ------------- The People Protest Actions Speak Louder Than Words |
Posted By: Lethal
Date Posted: 20 Sep 2016 at 12:45am
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don't you just love it, all these years some of us have been jumped on swore about have no idea what we are talking about, F^*kin shame on you.u know who you are. there got it off my chest, THANKS! thanks Kevin, yes it goes even further than this, there are lots of dodgy deals as well, National President is one that comes to mind, why would he rocket off to Japan and sell part of his shares to someone when he has no interest in them, but still purchased them as he was a friend, that happened the next day the Archimedes paper was made public," just asking" LIE'S, DIVERSION,, CRIMINALS, TAX EVASION, SO MUCH BULL **** too many people involved, they are worse than a DRUG GANG, yet not one will ever go to court. |
Posted By: John H
Date Posted: 20 Sep 2016 at 5:24am
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Mower Man I have to disagree with just about everything you say in the posts above. It seems that your sources have been exaggerating. We are calling for a commission of inquiry into the QMS and why it has failed to deliver the stewardship they claimed it would. Time this Government showed some leadership (other than unilaterally creating the Kermadec Ocean Sanctuary).
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Posted By: Tagit
Date Posted: 20 Sep 2016 at 7:22am
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John - I very much doubt you will see a commission of inquiry into the QMS as the government is quite obviously actively involved in hiding the realities of the QMS from the public. For them to allow a commission they would need to set the terms of reference incredibly narrow to avoid exposing themselves and I doubt they will take the risk. What would be interesting would be for a mass media outlet of some sort to use our fisheries management examples to show that the government is incompetent/corrupt, with the focus on the incompetence and potential corruption rather than the fisheries itself. There is a mass of stuff now in the public arena that would be hugely embarrassing if it was all pulled together into a cohesive story. Much wider public interest in that than just the fishery itself. Get that story together properly and then you might get your commission |
Posted By: mowerman
Date Posted: 20 Sep 2016 at 7:43am
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John H.. I will copy what I posted and remind you of my statement at a later date when it becomes more public...Im sure Scott knows what Im talking about ------------- The People Protest Actions Speak Louder Than Words |
Posted By: feeder
Date Posted: 20 Sep 2016 at 7:48am
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Shot Lethal, so lets all pull together and do something to help. Before anyone starts pointing the finger I do send a monthly payment to Legasea in the hope we get a united voice rather than a divided one. Cheers ------------- The only bar to frequent is the Kawhia Bar |
Posted By: mowerman
Date Posted: 20 Sep 2016 at 8:29am
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Currently, there’s a scheme being executed to gain control of the Hauraki Gulf and its surrounds. It’ll give a few from 26 tribal groups incredible power over a massive and very critical 4,000km² body of water (from near Mangawhai in the North down to Waihi in the south, and beyond Great Barrier Island to the east), along with the significant land catchments bordering the entire eastern coast of Auckland, the extensive Hauraki Plains, the entire Coromandel Peninsula, and the many islands of the Gulf. Who will be affected by this? Think shipping, the Port of Auckland, aquacultural farms, commercial or recreational fishing, ferries, tourism, leisure, sport, every marina, ramp, buoy or mooring, and landowners – possibly even commercial air space, bridges and roads. And if there’s not enough money coming from these sources to fill the iwi coffers, there are always the defenceless ratepayers of Auckland City to squeeze a bit more from. ------------- The People Protest Actions Speak Louder Than Words |
Posted By: mowerman
Date Posted: 20 Sep 2016 at 8:33am
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Since 2000, the Gulf has been managed by the Hauraki Gulf Forum with Auckland Council as its administering authority. Its board includes Ministry bureaucrats, elected representatives of all the region’s councils, plus 6 self-nominated tribal representatives appointed by the Minister of Conservation. Unsurprisingly, there has been gross dysfunction in the Forum. In his 2015 report, management consultant Dr Nigel Bradly put it down to the “inability or unwillingness of members to act as a ‘political peer group’…….the mismatch of willingness, understanding and expectations of members is at the heart of the failure of the Forum to promote the objectives of the Act.” This highlights the obvious − a fundamental conflict inherent in having elected representatives (some of whom are working in the public’s best interests, i.e. for the region’s environmental and economic health) and those of appointed, totally self-serving parties wanting to increase their power and wealth. Lack of Due Process To rid the Forum of its pesky conscientious objectors, a purposely selected team was tasked with coming up with a new governance model – one which would prioritise the tribes’ financial interests in fishing and pursuit of treaty settlements over the Gulf’s many harbours. There’s no suggestion that principles of democracy, good governance or working in the best interests of the entire regional population formed any part of the Report’s recommendations. They require that: ------------- The People Protest Actions Speak Louder Than Words |
Posted By: cirrus
Date Posted: 20 Sep 2016 at 9:12am
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Assuming all the above is correct,and it seems it is then we are seeing an asset ,marine land grab by a confederation of officials with the backing of our so called democratic -elected government. Sounds like Communism -Socialism is flourishing in N.Z. They are both the same. Communism is the taking of assets and peoples freedom at the point of a gun. Socialism is to achieve the same via the vote. |
Posted By: v8-coupe
Date Posted: 20 Sep 2016 at 12:23pm
This is what happens when you give a document "partnership" status when that was never its intention. Then throw the term "co-governance" around and to rub salt into the wound the co-governance parties are subsidized by the tax/rate payer who effectively lose 50% of any say yet pay nearly if not 100% of the costs. Effectively the co-governor's siphon of revenue while paying for nothing. Add to this mix gutless liberal culturally sensitive/scared, business friendly politicians, both central and local and this is the result. Good huh. ------------- Legasea Legend Member |
Posted By: Marligator
Date Posted: 20 Sep 2016 at 7:18pm
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Mowerman sadly I agree with what you are saying as I have heard this as well. Interesting times ahead for the Hauraki Gulf, and this will only be a pre-cursor for roll out throughout the whole of NZ if it goes smoothly. ------------- http://www.legasea.co.nz" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: mowerman
Date Posted: 20 Sep 2016 at 8:42pm
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Sadly to say our fisheries is wrapped in this...the current sna1 proposals are interwoven ..I know for a fact there are some very unsavory characters involved . But the short of it..your being sold out ------------- The People Protest Actions Speak Louder Than Words |
Posted By: pjc
Date Posted: 20 Sep 2016 at 9:22pm
 See some do do there homework first
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Posted By: John H
Date Posted: 21 Sep 2016 at 2:08am
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My understanding of the Hauraki Gulf Marine Park Act is that they have no legislative "teeth". So they hoped that having a consensus Sea Change Plan would be the catalyst for The Minister of Primary Industries or Minister of Conservation to take action. Changing fisheries regulations is still under the Fisheries Act 1996. It has its own duty to consult. Maybe Councils can do something under the Resource Management Act on seabed impacts. No doubt we can have this conversation when the plan is released.
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Posted By: pjc
Date Posted: 21 Sep 2016 at 2:54am
| Remember what Everlyn? said John,local authority is the starting place.they have a duty or right to make sure our enviroment/seabed is protected.(something close to that.) |
Posted By: mowerman
Date Posted: 21 Sep 2016 at 4:30am
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They do not spend millions running around having meetings and consulting for nothing...They are here for a reason... There recommendations will be put to council and the will be adopted and made into laws.No ifs or buts about it. Some people are have got vested interests in this..IWI..Waitangi settlement claims...it will happen...It's happening. Time for everyone to open their eyes. ------------- The People Protest Actions Speak Louder Than Words |
Posted By: pjc
Date Posted: 21 Sep 2016 at 1:43pm
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There 2 that i know of involved in the sea change group who should be standing up against this,maybe they are i have not seen any report where they have commented on. John H ,after the talk that Dr Daniel Pauly gave along with Evelyn Pinkerton has there been a follow up on what action to take against the Auckland council as far enviromental issues regarding the seabed?Remember Evelyn won the battle for a free swimming salmon in a river inB.C for the native indians. Why are local IWI being quite??
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Posted By: mowerman
Date Posted: 21 Sep 2016 at 11:50pm
That's interesting comment Paul . About Local iwi being so quiet..But in behind the scenes there is much disfunction and dissatisfaction and ongoing conflict over Mooks Honneck Waitangi treaty money's spent on pet projects and of course the development at TeAri. Fishing matters I have ever spoken about to a few but they would most likely get banned in here.Sand extraction royalties .Money taken off Ngati Manuhiri by Ngatiwai and spent outside the local iwi area .It's a huge complex issue . Not everyone is computer literate and there are a lot of older folks.Trying to unite and progress issues forward is difficult. Talking only about Ngati Manuhiri Iwi only here. ------------- The People Protest Actions Speak Louder Than Words |