Quality mudfish here, superb conditioned fish - most of them - North island salmon even?

Typical fat rainbow just over 2kg caught on a grey ghost fly in 28m.

Its not easy, having to present the right fly, in the right place or location, at the right time and most importantly keeping it there for long enough at right depth. Even doing all of this the fish reject your fly most of the time. A quality fishfinder / gps plotter is a must - and you need to know how to use it.

The sight of a large, fat bodied, silver rainbow cartwheeling  10m from the boat before ejecting my fly will stay in my mind a while.

Brendan James , below with fish of the day - 3.6kg weighed 8 hours later and there are bigger fish in this lake for sure.

Annoying breeze from the west - not fresh at all but just enough to complicate the drift of teh boat. A minekota would be great!

Only a couple of months left before  Lake Rotoiti closes , then probably not back until late this year/next year - Given quality of fish available maybe another trip or two before I switch my freshwater attentions to Taupo/Turangi again.

Caught 13 on the SLF smelt I tied, 8 on Grey Ghost and 5 on the bully fly.    Dropped several as well     I also had a small Jack Sprat in the line-up but replaced that when it got ignored in favour of the others.  

 

Rainbow

 

  

Fish in 20m for us as well and fly choice very simiar to you.

We might have seen you I think up eastern end of lake - we were in a 14foot open tinny , tiller driven with FLEUR on the side - my mates boat.

Rainbow

 

Those smelt are why these Rotoiti trout are so special.

Rainbow

 

Brent Sharp fishing blind as his FF packed up on day one     Alfie Amor on his pedal drive yak ideal for holding over fish and fishing at the same time.    Some nice fat fish and huge smelt when compared to the smelt fly we were using.  Correction: Top fish was 9lbs not under 8 as stated above.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kexAJLawuh8" rel="nofollow - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kexAJLawuh8

 

Rainbow

Intense schools of smelt everywhere, fish were holding in 22-26m for us.

The fish are moving around a bit - showing in different places each trip.

Kept 5, released 3 , lost 3 - many hits failing to hook up

Biggest 66cm, 7lb.

I heard Whakatane fishing club had a comp on Rotoiti in the weekend.

I was over last tuesday and had a great morning, any one else do ok in the last week?

Cheers Jamie

An annoying  easterly limited my options alot, the hot lumo yellow flies that worked last month caught nothing. 2 EACH ON Pat Swift Jack spratt, Grey ghost and traffic light killer pattern. Only kept the one that wouldnt revive - most of them were fat obese 2.5lb footballs. Had another 4 or 5 hits. Snapped off one on jack spratt on a double strike.

Caught fish at the skids, off the willows off emerys store hinehopu, and up just past ski lane on northern shore.

Off the willows fish holding in 26m , similar in other places.

Spoke to a chap fishing hard into one of the cliffs and had some better fish - he said in 17m and got them all around 2pm. Similar bite to me.

What flies were doing the job for you?

So how does this relate to the above smelt fly example when there are a million other smelt close by?    IMO the unnatural jigging action identifies the grey ghost as a "wounded buffalo" that triggers the predatory attack instinct of a trout that might not even be looking for food at that time.    It may also account for the attack on completely unnatural looking "Attractor Style" flies.

 

That brings into focus the importance of the jigging action.   What action comes closest to imitate a wounded smelt?    Is it just a slow lowering and raising of the rod or could that be improved?   On my last trip I watched a nearby guy in a dinghy hooking up regularly.  Interestingly he employed a few very pronounced short, almost spastic wrist flicks followed by a pause then more flicks.    Before long his rod bent down with another strike.   The guy was not just fishing a smelt imitation he was fishing a "wounded smelt."

 

 I studied that action for a while and did it myself.    It definitely worked better than my monotonous lift and drop.   

 

Rainbow

Could try anchoring I suppose.

However remember a couple of times last year when I was having a tough day and spoke to two anchored boats who were doing considerably better than I. Slow for sure but they put some good fish in the bin.

Anyway good luck with whatever method you use.     Better than moving the lawn.

 

Rainbow

 

 

Rainbow

 

BTW when talking about contrast it reminds me of an experiment I did a few years ago to camouflage my fly line.    I coiled it and immersed half the coil in a die solution which resulted in a 6" pattern of different shades of green.    It looked really sexy on the water until the line moved.   Then every dark section moved on its own and looked like a series of wagons dragged across the surface.  Far from being camouflaged the contrast between light and dark moving made it highly visible .

 

There is currently a fly line company offering the same camo patterns which will have the same effect.

 

There are plenty of suckers who believe anything endorsonators tell them without thinking it through themselves.

 

Rainbow

I know the difference between smelt and whitebait and the difference between smelt from Taupo and Rotoiti.  The photo is of Rotoiti smelt.    If you look carefully you can see a Jack Sprat fly next to the smelt.

 

 

 

Just catching up on it.

As per my post in one of Rainbow's earlier threads re smelt flies, my experience jigging at Tarawera was interesting in terms of two points made above.

1. I had to row to ensure the old tin dinghy i was in didn't just shoot across the surface in very blustery offshore winds. i just did short choppy strokes to stay in the general area and make sure my line was more or less vertical.

2. That leads to my second point - that being solo and resting the rod on the stern of the dinghy (with my foot on the butt) while I did my short, choppy oar strokes, would have - I'm sure - given the set of smelt flies the jerky action of a dying baitfish as the sinker bounced on the bottom in the chop. That kind of twitchy movement would be hard to replicate with the rod in the hand.

As for the colours discussion: I always found it interesting that Gary Kemsley's fairly well known marabou night pattern, which he has written about on numerous occasions as being absolutely deadly, had an olive body and a red wool tag. You'd think that was pointless at night? But he was very clear about the recipe.

The same discussion above re colours is applicable for those who do softbaiting in the salt. At 18m, is a Nuclear Chicken green and red, or grey and brown? At 45m, all colour is supposed to be gone. But I've seen first hand how one particular colour seems to work better despite five guys doing exactly the same thing.

As Rainbow points out, the fish are the ultimate judge. Even if colours are muted, there may be certain fluorescent factors in certain lures or materials that we can't see with our eyes, including the UV content. Some people swear by it.

My thinking is that fish in the lakes may zone in on the flash which we've all seen smelt give off when the make a sudden change of direction. Stand on a lakeside jetty with smelt swimming around and you suddenly see one fish flutter silver. As do sprats and piper etc in the salt. So even if colours are washed out, and smelt are camouflaged near the bottom by their colouration adapted to the surroundings, they detect that alarm signal - like the underside of a deer's tail, Rainbow?

I get the point re silhouette hunting, but maybe flies which incorporate large eyes, a bit of flash (but not too much), and the right movement, are the 'supernormal releaser' for the lake fish we're targeting.

I certainly caught some great fish at Tarawera on the Swift epoxy jack sprat which would have had almost no silhouette - but it has big, obvious eyes, the right profile, and as it jerked and twitched every so often it would have given off a little flash.

Anyway, just my thoughts.

 

Rainbow

I remember the few times I tried shoreline fishing at Night at Rotoiti quite a few years ago now - I was inexperienced then and didnt catch any but on 3 occassions tried didnt see any other  fish caught by the crowd at Ruato either. Maybe just a quiet period which does happen.

Interesting comments from guys that obviously know what they are doing shoreline fishing now. ALTHOUGH A 5-6 LB average is still significantly superior to Taupo at the moment.

I have heard some reasonable shoreline reports from Okataina lately.

Do people think the larger fish were caught jigging back in the summer / early autumn? Is that usual at Rotoiti? That is definitely my experience and observation.

We dont want Rotoiti to go the way of Tarawera and loose all these big fish that have made this lake famous for quite a while now.

 

Rainbow

Good points raised there- everyone really.

Spare a thought for us poor Jafas that only get to fish 4-5 times a season !! We cant have you locals catching ALL the big fish! Joke.

How did you find the season overall RC17? COMPARED to previous years and and different patterns developing 

/ You can pm me if you prefer?

The issue will come down to $$- who sells more licences? A family of four jigging equals as many licences as you can fit at some of the smaller stream mouths. I hope something is done.... but I'm not hopeful.

 

Rainbow

Look at Taupo - much cleaner/clearer water and possibly not enough algae production for smelt food?

I'm no scientist, but as an armchair critic, one would have to question the merit of continuing to harvest eggs from Tarawera given there has probably only been a handful of 10lb+ fish pulled of that lake in the last 5 years combined.... Suppose that's where the infrastructure and consistent fish runs come into play though.

It is interesting though to hear different opinions and compare to previous years.

As I understand it the continued collection of breeding fish from Tarawea is to regularly supplement the hatchery bred R strain with "wild" stock to prevent inbreeding.     F&G also harvest "late" spawners in order to extend the Rotoiti winter lake shore fly fishing season.

 

Rainbow

Agreed mate,our  best season jigging on Rotoiti in the last 4 years, fat fish and plenty of them in a fair few spots  . Man i can not wait for summer.

Rainbow   

Rainbow 

 

Rainbow

It is generally known that the quality of fish at this lake has gone down in recent years. While this is regrettable it makes any big fish from there that much more valuable.   

 

Why? Because under these stressed living conditions a few fish seem to have done better than the average.     So why have they done better?    Have they figured out how to exploit existing food sources better?    Do they convert food into trout flesh more efficiently?   Do they reach maturity later than the average?    Do they display a preference for say Koura or small trout as opposed to largely living on smelt?    Whatever that is it is clear that their superior size is no accident.

 

In other livestock breeding such minute trait are carefully identified and replicated in subsequent breeding programmes, which over time results in high performance animals.     

 

Why only focus on Tarawera?    Are there other sources worth looking at?   

What makes the rainbows of the Flaxy Lakes grow so well.    I have fished there for a good 20 years and have personally seen rainbows coming out of the lower lake up to 14.5lbs.    I have also caught quite a few rainbows to near 10lbs but never one reaching the magic 10lbs.    

 

What makes me interested in this lake is the fact that these fish grow to this size in a couple of ponds that have no koura  no smelt and until recently no large snails     How do I know this?    My good friend Rudi Ferris has a very comprehensive written record of stomach contents of all fish killed during January- April, dating back for at least 15years.    None of the above mentioned examples have ever shown up.     So what is it that makes these trout grow to this size?    Worth having a closer look.    A few big fish can be harvested before the poachers get them from the small spawning stream exiting into the top lake.

 

The R-Strain programme has been a huge success, which shows what innovative thinking can produce.    What other possibilities are out there that can address todays challenges?

 

Rainbow

 

PS One often sees large rainbows in Lake Taupo containing several koura.    From all the thousands of trout I have caught there such trout are the exception.    Yet there are millions of koura in this lake while most of the starving rainbows are chasing tiny smelt.   

 

This is an interesting question that might be equally if not more relevant to the largely Put and Take Rotorua lakes fisheries.    Can trout be conditioned to develop a taste for koura from the fry stage by being fed finely blended koura particles in the hatchery?        I am pretty sure that if koura were to form part of their daily diet as they grow up in the rearing races they would very likely hunt wild koura once released into the lakes.

 

        

 

What impressed me was the recoil braid and how it activated the lure.    I think this could give the jigging flies some extra spastic movement.     I don't have access to this braid and have used a single strand of rubber from the core of a shock cord.     I used a Swift swivel for the dropper and this avoided most dropper tangles with the main line when the fly jumped.   The rubber band really jerked the fly around; at least in the air.    Will have to try it in clear water to see if it also gives these erratic jerks.

 

In one of my previous posts I commented on watching a guy wrist flicking the rod to produce a more erratic fly movement.    I wonder if the rubber band will do much the same.

 

Rainbow

I know who imports the current nz range of savage gear so will ask if they plan to bring this product in .

Speaking to Pat swift he often leaves the Rods in rod holder when trout jigging - so movement not always that important? Probably depends on the day - sometime fish want more action before they strike.

Can see how this  recoil braid system could cross over to soft baiting and micro jigging for snapper too.

In his excellent book on soft baiting, John Eichelsheim has several sections which mention drop shotting using a Palomar knot on the leader - which keeps the hook (worm or circle) perpendicular to the leader in a similar way to that complicated looking set up that guy uses.

That elastic bottom section is an innovation beyond what John writes about, but I have used his version with pretty good success on snapper in the Waitemata while at anchor in about 20m. I just put a rig with two Gulp 4" grubs above a tear drop sinker in the rod holder while i fish bait out the back. Standing straight out from the leader, head into the current, gave the grubs' tails a fantastic wriggling action and the snapper went for it.

As an aside, I don't think I've ever seen a video with more logo placement than that one. It's a wonder he hasn't got Savage Gear tattooed on his forehead - possibly will have that in his contract next time!

Obviously that's not going to be very effective if it's flat calm.

And you have to guard against point loading a graphite rod if your rod holder is very vertical.

Re the rod point loading I use a Railblaza directional rod holder so rod is actually not far off horizontal to water not perpendicular where you could easily get into trouble. Most rod holders that are set into gunwhales are not like this so care needs to be taken.

I like your experiment with the soft baits in the current - good thinking there.

Im off to first Turangi trip of the winter next month - looking forward to both boat fishing the Tongariro delta with boobys and glo bugs, as well as joining the crowds up the rivers . Maybe a sneaky jig somewhere ie Tokaanu hole?

 

Easy to make.     Heavier for sea fishing.

 

Rainbow

Still I heard Rainbow landed one very nice 6lber amongst a few others so always worth a crack.

Rc - were you seeing any of the sign alot deeper than normal? ie over 30m?

Selling my camry  - 2007 160km only 7800!! - to get a suv then im there.

Pleased you boys are giving the trout a good stir up before I arrive!

Any last minute intell - will share mine of course.

I hooked 7 and landed 2 jigging. Just under 4lb best .

No schools of smelt and fish very few and far between on sounder.

Hooked most fish around 30m mark.

My mate hooked one and landed one.