Leader?????
Printed From: The Fishing Website
Category: Saltwater Fishing
Forum Name: Popper and Topwater Fishing
Forum Description: If you're into a bit of action on top, this is the forum for you
URL: https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=106821
Printed Date: 06 Jun 2026 at 1:46pm
Topic: Leader?????
Posted By: J-D
Subject: Leader?????
Date Posted: 19 Jan 2015 at 8:45pm
|
Hi guys,
Is there a right or wrong leader you can use? Is there one purposely made for stick bias/ poppers?
Cheers
JD
|
Replies:
Posted By: Pico
Date Posted: 19 Jan 2015 at 8:47pm
|
This stuff is good http://yeehaa.co.nz/index.php?route=product/product&path=15_86&product_id=706
|
Posted By: kaveman
Date Posted: 19 Jan 2015 at 8:57pm
Super stealth by Fisherman is good
-------------
www.kavemantackle.co.nz
|
Posted By: J-D
Date Posted: 19 Jan 2015 at 9:52pm
Thanks fella's
|
Posted By: ginga
Date Posted: 19 Jan 2015 at 11:29pm
There really isn't a right or wrong leader to use but some work better. Main thing is one that doesn't break is a good start, sounds logical right but I've had some unreliable leader in the past. For casting a more supple trace will sit nicely on your reel and make casting easier, less wind knots and tip wraps too. Stiff leader or flouro tends to want to fly off the reel and comes off in big loops which wrap up. Brand wise varivas is nice but not cheap, I quite like the suffix zippy. Have used it a lot and not had any issues and is very affordable and most good shops stock it.
------------- www.extremesportfishing.co.nz. Agent for Carpenter, Orion and ASWB products
|
Posted By: fish i
Date Posted: 20 Jan 2015 at 6:02pm
JM Terminator = cheaper, thinner gauge, more supple than Varivas, Yo-zuri supples and the likes that I've used. Good stuff. Available at your local, good ones. They should market it as casting topwater leader.
|
Posted By: eynon
Date Posted: 20 Jan 2015 at 6:07pm
i use blackmagic supple trace
|
Posted By: southernwanderer
Date Posted: 20 Jan 2015 at 9:41pm
|
On the subject of leaders, what is the main cause of the line catching/wrapping the first guide? My main line is suffix 832 50lb, this is fg knotted to 100 mono, has happened 3 times with different brands each time, resulting in a crack off each time (lucky to get lure back each time).
|
Posted By: laidbackdood
Date Posted: 21 Jan 2015 at 3:13am
eynon wrote:
i use blackmagic supple trace  |
nothing wrong with that stuff.......its soft so knots will bed in nicely....esp FG and PR knots.
------------- Once the idiots turn up..Im outta here...No time for Drama Queens.
|
Posted By: laidbackdood
Date Posted: 21 Jan 2015 at 3:17am
southernwanderer wrote:
On the subject of leaders, what is the main cause of the line catching/wrapping the first guide? My main line is suffix 832 50lb, this is fg knotted to 100 mono, has happened 3 times with different brands each time, resulting in a crack off each time (lucky to get lure back each time). |
There are plenty of theories behind this....but most common is the wind blowing across the line ............the most likely cause is an overly spooled spool of braid.......Dont over spool with braid or get a rod with fuji kw guides(anti wind knot guides) that prevent wind knots. What reel you using?
------------- Once the idiots turn up..Im outta here...No time for Drama Queens.
|
Posted By: southernwanderer
Date Posted: 21 Jan 2015 at 7:39am
|
Stella 10ksw, spooled to about a 1/4 up the gold lip, so 2-3m below the top of spool, so not what you would call over full. Fist time it happened i was casting with a wrap of leader on spool, thought that was the issue and went to casting with fg on castin finger, but has happened twice since. Would not be to worried if fishing from boat, but sucks when your fishing off the shore!
|
Posted By: ginga
Date Posted: 21 Jan 2015 at 11:24am
First thing I would try would be to shorten up the leader a bit. Nice and easy step. If that fails rip off 20m of braid and see what happens.
------------- www.extremesportfishing.co.nz. Agent for Carpenter, Orion and ASWB products
|
Posted By: KingySlayer
Date Posted: 21 Jan 2015 at 12:56pm
southernwanderer wrote:
On the subject of leaders, what is the main cause of the line catching/wrapping the first guide? My main line is suffix 832 50lb, this is fg knotted to 100 mono, has happened 3 times with different brands each time, resulting in a crack off each time (lucky to get lure back each time). |
Mate is this happening on first cast straight after a fresh respool? What can happen is over time with casting and retreiving, you are moving the rod to fast and winding in sloppy line. What happens then is say the top 50m of braid is really soft on the spool then when you go to cast the line is tight as heck when rod is loaded. The tight line then drags the "not-tight" line with it causing knots and all kinds of caose. What you can do is check the hardness of the spooling after say every 20 cast by squeezing the braid. If starting to feel soft just light flick lure out let it take all sloppy line and then simply wind the lure back onto spool (dont sweep). This will give you tight braid again on spool.
I cast with 2 wraps of 130lb varivas on the spool of our saltigas with ah jb hollow 100lb and never have an issue.
But worth a look see anyway mate.
------------- www.assassinsportsfishing.com www.facebook.com/assassinjigteam
|
Posted By: strx7
Date Posted: 21 Jan 2015 at 8:16pm
trying to cast to far with too much effort/force/speed can also cause it to do that.
|
Posted By: MadKeen#
Date Posted: 21 Jan 2015 at 10:32pm
KingySlayer wrote:
southernwanderer wrote:
On the subject of leaders, what is the main cause of the line catching/wrapping the first guide? My main line is suffix 832 50lb, this is fg knotted to 100 mono, has happened 3 times with different brands each time, resulting in a crack off each time (lucky to get lure back each time). |
Mate is this happening on first cast straight after a fresh respool? What can happen is over time with casting and retreiving, you are moving the rod to fast and winding in sloppy line. What happens then is say the top 50m of braid is really soft on the spool then when you go to cast the line is tight as heck when rod is loaded. The tight line then drags the "not-tight" line with it causing knots and all kinds of caose. What you can do is check the hardness of the spooling after say every 20 cast by squeezing the braid. If starting to feel soft just light flick lure out let it take all sloppy line and then simply wind the lure back onto spool (dont sweep). This will give you tight braid again on spool.
I cast with 2 wraps of 130lb varivas on the spool of our saltigas with ah jb hollow 100lb and never have an issue.
But worth a look see anyway mate. |
If your leader is too long it can be an issue sometimes. I found that if my leader was long enough to reach the spool when casting the centrifugal force of the PR knot coming off the spool would cause it to wrap right round the blank and first guide. That was with 832 50 lb and 100 lb Yo zuri. Hasn't happened since I reduced my leader length to about a metre.
|
Posted By: laidbackdood
Date Posted: 22 Jan 2015 at 6:44am
|
I have a 4 or 5 metre trace with varivas Gt pe6 and 130 pound varivas leader...........never had that but then i have the KW fuji anti tangle guides on my synit topshot lalandi also. Good advise from Ginga and kingyslayer i reckon......they are out there doing it all the time.. Arron from the LBG section has used the same amount of trace on his sw18000 with his carpenter blue chaser for a long time and hasnt had any issues either....both lbg and charters. The soft braid would be my pick  ...seeing you have ruled out over spooling. Strx has a point too.
------------- Once the idiots turn up..Im outta here...No time for Drama Queens.
|
Posted By: southernwanderer
Date Posted: 22 Jan 2015 at 8:28am
|
Leader length is from casting finger to rod tip then about half a rod length to lure. This was one of the first things i did adjust, might have to try a few session with the kaibutsu as it has the k guides, see if that makes a difference.
|
Posted By: KingySlayer
Date Posted: 22 Jan 2015 at 8:30am
strx7 wrote:
trying to cast to far with too much effort/force/speed can also cause it to do that.
|
This is a wicked statement also ^. You will find that casting with the rod doing the work will get you almost as far as giving it the goliath swing. But yes to much effort can cause this.
Madkeen how long is your PR? I have experimented with way to much leader on the spool and never had an issue? I guess it could be a combination of many things, cross winds, sloppy line, over spooled, fluro carbon. ...
We use Synit Van Deimen rods with K guides. All rods ranging from the x13 to x58 we have never had an issue.
------------- www.assassinsportsfishing.com www.facebook.com/assassinjigteam
|
Posted By: Titahi
Date Posted: 22 Jan 2015 at 11:24am
|
Wind knots ARE caused by the simple mechanics of line leaving the spool faster than it can exit the tip of the rod. The result is line spiralling in concertina off the spool and unable to be choked( funneled into the guide fast enough) it wraps around the guide as opposed to travelling through it ........ The effect can occur anywhere on the guide train, but is more prevalent at the stripper guide as this is where the line is moving fastet as it comes off the spool. Over powering the cast will cause it Too light a lure for the guide train/ braid spool configuration will cause it. Knots catching on the guide train will cause it. Casting into the wind will cause it. Over spooling the line on a spool will cause it.
K guides dont eliminate the effect, they only reduce the likelyhood of the line snagging on the guide by default of their forward slant.
------------- "I love standing by the ocean and just knowing what its for"
|
Posted By: laidbackdood
Date Posted: 22 Jan 2015 at 5:21pm
Above is spot on....The last line...I dont agree with so much(i think its very effective.there is a video on you tube demonstrating how it works) .....well i have never had one and neither has arron and we both use synits with those KW guides.....on a side note......A useful thing i learned from somewhere else which might help you.........hang the lure ...close to half way down the rod when casting.......not up near the top............you have more of a pendulum type cast......so it will go further with less effort.......doing this way..........I dont even hear the PR knot go through the guides at all.......I do a 1 and a half to 2 inch PR knot......keep it short.......then i put uv knot sense over the half hitches and a light smear between fingers and fondle the PR itself........protects the whole knot and makes it slip through the guides better.....that knot aint going no where!....by keeping it short and putting uv knot sense on your knot......you can eliminate your knot catching on the guides.
------------- Once the idiots turn up..Im outta here...No time for Drama Queens.
|
Posted By: Titahi
Date Posted: 23 Jan 2015 at 11:29am
|
LBD can you explain how KW guides stop line leaving the spool faster than it can exit the rod tip?
I'll try and explain it again for you..... When the line is travelling faster at the stripper guide than at the tip the line bunches up, and loops around guides/blank. Seeing as how the insert material in KW guides is the same as used in other guides it will have the same drag co-efficient. The only difference is the forward slanted guide feet are less prone to collecting the loops that accumulate when wind casts develop, therefore any wind cast developed loops slid forward off the guide.... I also have rods with KW guides, sorry but a sample of 2 isnt representive enough for me to be sold, and it flies in the face of the actual physics of wind knots.
I did say "K guides dont eliminate the effect, they only reduce the likelyhood of the line snagging"
------------- "I love standing by the ocean and just knowing what its for"
|
Posted By: laidbackdood
Date Posted: 23 Jan 2015 at 8:13pm
Titahi wrote:
LBD can you explain how KW guides stop line leaving the spool faster than it can exit the rod tip?
I'll try and explain it again for you..... When the line is travelling faster at the stripper guide than at the tip the line bunches up, and loops around guides/blank. Seeing as how the insert material in KW guides is the same as used in other guides it will have the same drag co-efficient. The only difference is the forward slanted guide feet are less prone to collecting the loops that accumulate when wind casts develop, therefore any wind cast developed loops slid forward off the guide.... I also have rods with KW guides, sorry but a sample of 2 isnt representive enough for me to be sold, and it flies in the face of the actual physics of wind knots.
I did say "K guides dont eliminate the effect, they only reduce the likelyhood of the line snagging" |
 ............there is a video on you tube showing you how the knots untangle themselves.....so its not so much they eliminate the knots happening.....they eliminate them causing trouble....the guides design untangles them so they dont cause a problem....will see if i can find the link.....I know synit use them a lot and they are a very well respected rod maker.
------------- Once the idiots turn up..Im outta here...No time for Drama Queens.
|
Posted By: laidbackdood
Date Posted: 23 Jan 2015 at 8:27pm
|
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sYzmg0MURkc
no sound on this but interesting....none the less.
------------- Once the idiots turn up..Im outta here...No time for Drama Queens.
|
|