Milky White Flesh in Snapper - Update

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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote smudge Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Aug 2023 at 9:23pm
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Here we go, a bit of a novel:

I've encountered my share of fish with this milky/mushy flesh. One thing I know is that the worst ones are easy to spot when caught. They are skinny. Without any actual data what I have noticed over my years of fishing out west is that by far the most common fish in this condition are kahawai and gurnard. I have caught literally thousands of kahawai from the Manukau harbour and Auckland's west coast. For around 25 years I've actively fished for them shore based. For 15 years or so I'd fish exclusively for kahawai at night over winter. Sometimes 3 to 5 times a week. I used bait, swf, flies, livies, jigs, home made lures, bare hooks, novelty  rigs such as beer can tabs etc etc.

 My point is that in all that time with a conservative estimate of 1000 kahawai from two land based locations over winter, I don't think I ever caught a skinny or milky fleshed kahawai. I would only keep no more than maybe 10% of those I caught but they were all fat little (mostly 1.5 to 3kg) chubby fullas.

On the boat however I would catch them all year round, sometimes in huge numbers. Over summer through to late autumn skinny kahawai were not really uncommon, especially from the harbour but the longest kahawai I ever caught was 72cm long and it weighed 3.1kg. It was in 8m off of Hamilton's Gap on the west coast and it made a baracoutta look muscle bound. I weighed it for a comp and won that category but it was only good for gurnard bait. To be fair it put up a good tussle considering its poor condition. To put that in perspective my heaviest kahawai was landbased in winter and weighed 3.6kg. It was around 63cm from memory. Having said that we got a very skinny kahawai out of the harbour two weeks ago.

Don't get me started on gurnard. OK I'll tell you anyway. The longest gurnard I've caught was 52cm long. It was from the Manukau harbour in February and weighed something like 1.1kg. That fish would go 1.6kg plus depending on condition. That like many others caught over summer in the harbour was skinny and inedible. These days I don't keep any skinny fish of any species, even for bait.

So west coast snapper Smudge? Ohhh yeah: Over spring and summer we get lots of snapper. None have looked skinny from off the coast but about 10% of those fish will have whiter looking flesh than the others which have that lovely translucent 'colour'. The whitish ones aren't bad enough to be mushy and they taste fine.

We iki all our fish, we take two 90 litre bins, one full of ice and the other for the fish. The ice goes in the fish bin straight away.

What all that means I have no idea! Big smile




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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote smudge Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Aug 2023 at 9:25pm
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To me it is clear nutrition plays a part. I am 100% certain that post spawn many fish of all species are in less than perfect nick
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote kimber7wsm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2023 at 5:53am
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I agree Smudge. The leading cause of skinny in any species is under feeding. Then possibly "P" but I don't think fish are dumb enough to take that s**t.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Dagwood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2023 at 8:06am
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Of 3 snapper caught just north of Whitianga 2 weeks ago, 1 had the milky flesh issue.

Never encountered it before (but haven't been out much recently) so only discovered on the filleting bench.  
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Kandrew Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2023 at 10:25am
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Might be time to target other fish and fish the west coast more.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Reel Deal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2023 at 7:39pm
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Nah poroae and mullet are vegan 
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote smudge Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2023 at 9:54pm
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Originally posted by Reel Deal Reel Deal wrote:

Nah poroae and mullet are vegan 

I've never found a cabbage in the gut of a porae or mullet
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote smudge Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Aug 2023 at 9:55pm
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Not even kale
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Dagwood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Aug 2023 at 8:03am
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Has anyone heard how the commercial sector are dealing with this? Would be hard to tell which fish are affected until they're being processed. Therefore does the fisherman receive full payment and the fish come off their quota and the loss is picked up by the processor or is there a claw back system of some sort?
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Reel Deal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Aug 2023 at 8:47am
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Used to catch them on iceberg lettuce as kids Smudge. Without vegan dressing, but thinking about it that could have been the secret sauce🤔

Dagwood good question I wonder this too. Are they just dumped? Prob do as Comms just do the easiest not what’s best for the fisheries. Wonder if they care enough to look into checking condition before keeping. We will never know without cameras 
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Pcj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Aug 2023 at 9:43am
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Won't have to worry soon.price of fuel and chippy and his 12.5c increase
"Times up"
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Mc Tool Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Aug 2023 at 2:56pm
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Originally posted by kimber7wsm kimber7wsm wrote:

I agree Smudge. The leading cause of skinny in any species is under feeding. Then possibly "P" but I don't think fish are dumb enough to take that s**t.
well I hear the cops test the sewage for P so maybe the fish dont get a choiceTongue , I mean every time it rains , somewhere gets "overloaded " and spews untreated sewage into the ocean .LOLLOL
I wish I was young again .... Id be heaps smarter than this time
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Kandrew Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Aug 2023 at 5:50pm
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After that big rain dump in February the whole gulf was full of sewage and slit that would have killed off a lot of food supply for the fish have the fish recovered
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Pcj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Aug 2023 at 6:45pm
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Originally posted by Dagwood Dagwood wrote:

Has anyone heard how the commercial sector are dealing with this? Would be hard to tell which fish are affected until they're being processed. Therefore does the fisherman receive full payment and the fish come off their quota and the loss is picked up by the processor or is there a claw back system of some sort?
From A commercial trawlerman I just started communicating with.

I talk with NIWA Scientists up there occasionally; back in March they told me that for instance, 1 commercial boat had 20% of 1 landing got sent to the fishmeal plant as it was washed out sloppy white flesh; I asked him, he verified. There's actually plenty of fish, but Snapper just don't bite every day ,even if they are swimming around your lines;
"Times up"
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote muchalls Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Aug 2023 at 8:01pm
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Originally posted by kimber7wsm kimber7wsm wrote:

I agree Smudge. The leading cause of skinny in any species is under feeding. Then possibly "P" but I don't think fish are dumb enough to take that s**t.

They tried but couldn’t get a lighter to fire up under water….
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote brmbrm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Aug 2023 at 6:13pm
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Brought home 6 pannies on Thursday.  5 fine, 1 "a bit" milky and flesh fairly firm - half way in between OK and malnourished?They are going in the smoker tomorrow and will do a "blind" taste test on the missus.....

PS  Neighbours cats love the scraps, milky flesh or not

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Post Options Post Options   Likes (1) Likes(1)   Quote Mc Tool Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Aug 2023 at 7:13pm
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Originally posted by brmbrm brmbrm wrote:

  will do a "blind" taste test on the missus...

 
 and then try the fish ?LOL

I wish I was young again .... Id be heaps smarter than this time
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Demo_Fish Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Aug 2023 at 7:50pm
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Hey guys, just wondering a few things. Are most of your Milkys smaller fish or fish 40cm plus? Are they generally from deeper water or shallow? And by what means have they been caught? Ie bait, kabura, softbait, jig.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Reel Deal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Aug 2023 at 6:14am
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All sizes for me from 32cm to 11 pounds. Also all depths I fish under 50m. Mine caught mostly on bait. Fight well can’t tell till you lift them up and see skinny with sunken bit behind eyes. 

I also wonder is it something like a fish virus and -asses in a couple of weeks? Or kills the fish ?
Also I’m told and yet to test that if u -it in fridge for 24 hours the fillets come right? Sounds weird but I never rule anything out till I try it so will do if a milky gets past my vetting process boat side 
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote MB Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Aug 2023 at 7:32am
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The one properly milky fish I've eaten tasted OK. I'm a bit concerned that there is going to be a lot more catch and release of snapper caught in deeper water because of this problem. It's a tough call.
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