Need help with a DIY smoker

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    Posted: 13 Sep 2015 at 8:18am
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Hello,
 
Bought a cold smoke generator ( UFO ) and built myself a small ( 900x450x450 mm ) wooden box as a smoker. Drilled a hole at the bottom and attached the smoke generator to the box. Drilled several holes at the top as vents. I have a HUGE issue with condensation, no matter what I do and what I try after a few hours I have lots of condensation inside the smoker and on the product. product doesn't even smoke well as the water acts like a protective barrier.
What am I doing wrong? What can I do to have a proper smoke?
Does those Barklay's have the same issue or there is no condensation there at all? ( never seen one working )
Please help!
 
PS: I tried with fish, cheese, bacon, beef - it doesn't matter what's inside, the result is the same.
I am using manuka chips from Bunnings.
If pictures are needed I can take a few and attach them here.
Thanks
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote pjc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Sep 2015 at 9:11am
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is it possible that the timber you used to build smoker is damp and the heat/smoke is drawing the moisture out?
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Kenzo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Sep 2015 at 9:37am
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nope, it was ULTRA dry - was a very old particle board stored into a dry place
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Steps Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Sep 2015 at 9:46am
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How have u got it vented?
Or do u have a vent?
The chemical process of producing smoke.. or the left over carbon .. gives off the smoke, COx and water... so u do need to have correct ventilation(exhaust)  espec when cold smoking
I had a similar issue with condensation when 1st started to cold (well more accurately  warm) smoking. The smoker is inside the shed with a  flexible 100mm vent going out the door and up under the eves 3.6m up...the wet air and smoke would get up high in the vent then the water condense and run back down the inside into the smoker... giving a taint to the food and poor smoking.
Was fixed simple by putting a bow or sage in the flexible vent, a small drain hole for the condensed water to drain out.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote KikBac Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Sep 2015 at 10:12am
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote pjc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Sep 2015 at 10:44am
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Originally posted by Kenzo Kenzo wrote:

nope, it was ULTRA dry - was a very old particle board stored into a dry place
http://www.nzfishingworld.co.nz/how-to/2015/02/how-build-smokehouse


Particle board could be a concern,what chemicals/glue are used in the board?
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Kenzo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Sep 2015 at 11:39am
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I drilled quite a few vent holes at the top, the whole inside of smoker is damp and the condensation is even more prevalent on the product - very noticeable especially when I try and smoke cheese and as you said, the smoking result is quite poor.
Does anybody have experience with Barklay smokers? I might consider buying one of those but I would hate to run into the same problem ...
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Olfart Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Sep 2015 at 12:53pm
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Think you mean Bradley smokers Kenzo?
Personally, I wouldn't use chipboard to build a smoker with, because - as pjc said - there are a lot of nasties used to bind the woodchip together and this could leach out and spoil the taste of the food you are trying to smoke.  As regards the venting situation, the use of a long hose like Steps uses seems to create a venturi situation drawing excess moisture away from the interior of the smoker. 
That said, I think it could also depend where you use your smoker...if in a shed doorway (so you can maintain a low flame/temperature under the smoking medium) an exhaust pipe would definitely be the go as this helps to keep waste smoke from building up inside the shed - but if cold smoking, then positioning the smoker outside should be enough for the breeze to help suck out excess smoke (but possibly not moisture). 
If you can lay your hands on an old filing cabinet or a cabinet style clothes drier these make excellent smoking units.  Even an old dishwasher or a fridge can be easily converted for this purpose.
Semper in excreta sumus, solum profundum variat....



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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote MATTOO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Sep 2015 at 12:59pm
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You problems is primarily the wood.
Firstly you don't obviously care about your health or food quality. Or you wouldn't of used such a toxic wood.
That wood is weetbix and will always draw moisture.
Although proper venting is an issue here it is also far from your greatest concern.
There are woods suitable for being the case of the smoker. Two are cedar, and oak.
These have to be properly cured first, one is to charcoal the inside by burning, another is two run a number of hot smokes first through the system so the carbon soot and oils can seal
Just like a wok.
However I suggest you give away your attempt with wood. Don't be a cheapskate and build out of metal or ultimately buy a s/s model.
Any other solution is a joke.
Just cruising in my now sweetas pimped out Southern 755 HT0!
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Steps Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2015 at 8:09am
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I drilled quite a few vent holes at the top, the whole inside of smoker is damp and the condensation is even more prevalent on the product

Think that is the problem....have no  definite flow/draw.. and possbly the smoke not flowing...

And the comments on particule board .... fully agree with those...

The suggestions of filing cabinet above....but by the time u mess around with grill shelves, hinges, door / seals etc....as we orginally looked at...
Cheaper and more efficent to pick up a elcheapo cabinet type like in my pick for about $200....
Yep I put stronger magnets in to hold door tighter, custom seal out of silicone.. changed the wood chip box for an old cake tin with holes in...and had trouble keeping the temps below 50 deg for cold smoking... but as Oldfart says, the extra length of chimney and removing the little chimney that came with it to open that exhaust port open more fixed that.
The other issue with cold smoking in after market cabinet/ burner types is the have burners way too big and/ or the regular rated flow way to high... Which means either re setting the regular /or putting in a smaller burner... I re set the regulator.

PS do you dry off the fish before smoking?... VERY important
?  We  pat dry off the fillets before putting in fridge in the fridge over over night in a container with  drain grill on the bottom.
Next day they are marinated in the brine, sauce, flavours for between 1 1/2 to 2 hrs depending on size....then patted well dry again, malt brown sugar, as little as possible  then smoked.

Further detailed recipes, others and mine...which are basically others and tweaked a little for personal taste and mods for smoker, with pics are in older older threads on the subject....
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Kenzo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2015 at 11:19pm
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it's not particle board - when I bought it I specifically asked for something with NO chemicals / glues ...whatsoever as I was aware of the issues. It's like a hard pressed wood - I don't exactly know the name of it - several people told me that there are no nasty's in this one. Anyway - I don't mind giving up on it, I just want to know if the proper smokers like Bradley ( sorry for the name mix-up ) have this condensation issue as well or not.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Kenzo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2015 at 11:26pm
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I want a GOOD cold smoker - mainly for home made cheese, fish and sometimes bacon or sausages. I thought there is no huge science in building a smoker hence I tried to build this myself but I was obviously wrong.... even if I go for something else I might run into the same issues so better I buy something tested and reliable - but I really don't want to waste money into something and later to realize that I run into the same problems.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Steps Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Sep 2015 at 8:29am
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Like the thinking.
We used to smoke in old 45 gal drums.. pile dust in the bottom.. few holes thru top section for rods to hang fish, and damp hessian sack over the top...and leave over night.
Then there was the old mans one made out of and old up right cloths dryer.. basically same method.
And a friends.. and old 4 draw filing cabinet with a plywood door and small lpg burner in the bottom
Smokers.. well larger scale are very tolerant of design.. but the moment one starts to use a burner u also need a tray of water ....going up.. burner.. chip container, water tray... racks.  If dont cant control temps and a safety thing.. catches fat drips stops them catching fire around the burner and messing up the chip smoulder
From there it is just a matter of getting small enough burner flame for cold smoke,  exit flow rate just enough to release enough heat for cold smoking.

And making it big enough....u will find that say u come home with a good feed fish  fill the top 2 or 3 racks and think "what a waste of space..." and start to fill up with chicken drum sticks, sausages.. what ever is around....
Then progess to maybe a pork belly, or roast beef....
So do not skimp on size...
 Old school Rule of thumb be it a garden , tropical fish tank what ever.. decide what u need (at that point in time) and increase by at least 1/3

I do think (just my own personal thought) an important part of design is height greater than base dimensions.. eg 45 gal drum, filing cabinet etc.

Lots of good materials can construct in..  recycled tongue and groove flooring...un treated ply... construction/ boxing timber...
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Kenzo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Sep 2015 at 6:26pm
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I don't have space to store / use a huge box , hence me building this relatively small one. Also I don't need high temp smoke, I only use cold smoke - especially for cheese.
So what's the best solution for me?  - anybody please help.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Coochdog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Sep 2015 at 8:32pm
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What about an old oven cut down and altered to suit?regulary cold smoke in mine with no condensation issues.The flue has an adjustable dampner in it to adjust air flow and a gas ring to hot smoke,cook. oh and keep ya chips dry (hotwater cupboard etc) less moisture and resin in the UFO.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Steps Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 2015 at 9:00am
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There u go.. excellent example..
most old ovens, dish washers etc have stuffed seals.. good seals are a must.
For the perfect seal...
scrub off the area where the old seal goes.. clean free of grease
The area where the seal sits on the door, a generous coating of grease or Vaseline
Now run a bead of rtv silicone where the seal goes.. a good or several beads to give a good height.....
close the door and leave 24 hrs
If u open/ close door on the uncured rtv, u will get a couple patches of 'stickup' .. slice with a sharp blade
OR lay a sheet of newspaper over the door and close.

And this works a treat if your dishwasher or oven seals are gone... or seal drafts on the house doors , old wooden window frames, or making 'permanent' re seal-able/ usable gaskets for carburettors , diff cover plates , car light assemblies.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Clifftastic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 2015 at 9:41am
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This dude has a setup that would suit you


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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Big Manly Yaka Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 2015 at 12:10pm
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Hey Kenzo, I use a similar setup, wooden box and UFO smoker generator. I find if the wood chips are not ULTRA dry there is a lot of condensation buildup in the UFO tube, but don't really noticed it in the smoker itself much. Once I had it chocker full and there was a bit of condensation on the food, which resulted in a poor smoke. I thought at the time it was too full but since suspect it may be the chips used, or the fish wasn't dried properly. I also have a quite a few holes in mine (mainly due to poor workmanship) but this seems to help with keeping the temp down when I have the element on.
Yours situation seems very strange as I'm considering adding water bowls to mine to help with temp control and not over drying the fish too quickly.
Maybe look at your wood chips? I don't use the cheap Manuka chips from Warehouse etc anymore, I use larger chunks of stuff like Pohutukawa and Fejoa (cos its handy). But I make sure its all dried out really well before using it.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Kenzo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 2015 at 7:04pm
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I use large manuka chips from Bunnings - the sealed 1Kg bags ( 12 bucks a bag ) - I thought they are good.... I keep them inside the house in a plastic box to keep them dry.
I know what you saying, I've seen some condensation inside the UFO tube as well but my issue is the smoker box :(
 
Interesting concept on that video - never thought about the ice.....
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Kenzo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 2015 at 7:12pm
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If I buy this http://www.trademe.co.nz/sports/fishing/fish-smokers-cookers/auction-948882318.htm and attach the UFO to it via a hose so the smoke will cool down a bit till reaches the smoker you guys reckon would work?
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