TPPA

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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Kevin.S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Mar 2015 at 10:55am
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http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11423728
The news about TPPA just keeps getting worse.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote mowerman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Mar 2015 at 9:48am
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this will have serious adverse effects on all of us .. it  has to be stopped
The People Protest
    
Actions Speak Louder Than Words    
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote v8-coupe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Apr 2015 at 12:38pm
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Originally posted by mowerman mowerman wrote:

this will have serious adverse effects on all of us .. it  has to be stopped
 
Nope. J key and his trusty side kick Grosser say it will be all good. No wuckin forries.
Just like Rogernomics. It will be good for the whole country and we will all be wealthier and happier for it.
They should know and would never lie or deliberately misrepresent a situation.
Would they?
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote FizFisho Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Apr 2015 at 7:58am
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Originally posted by mowerman mowerman wrote:

this will have serious adverse effects on all of us .. it  has to be stopped


how do you go about stopping such things?

i personally dont know enough about its detail, but if everyone i hear is saying its bad, i tend to sway that way.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote cirrus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 May 2015 at 11:07pm
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Very interesting current interview with wiki leaks Julian Assange currently on web site zerohedge.

Some interesting insight on what is the biggest trade deal ever. But who knows what the content is as no one is allowed to know. But would appear its not about free trade but corporate control of govts and also internet among other things.

Interesting that N.Z is still going on about changing the Flag at about the time of Tppa,despite about 85% of people not interested. Why is govt persistent about this.

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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote v8-coupe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 May 2015 at 1:34pm
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Originally posted by cirrus cirrus wrote:

Very interesting current interview with wiki leaks Julian Assange currently on web site zerohedge.

Some interesting insight on what is the biggest trade deal ever. But who knows what the content is as no one is allowed to know. But would appear its not about free trade but corporate control of govts and also internet among other things.

Interesting that N.Z is still going on about changing the Flag at about the time of Tppa,despite about 85% of people not interested. Why is govt persistent about this.

Subterfuge, distraction, misdirection.
You are correct. The TPPA is not a trade agreement. It is a corporate take over. That is why there is so little in the way of chapters on actual trade and many many chapters on corporate rights. Bare in mind that one of the conditions on signing this agreement is that none of the contents become public until five years after the signing. Why? You are also correct that the big boys are trying to manipulate and control the internet. At least the visible one. The "black" net could be a tougher problem.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Kevin.S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jun 2015 at 4:30pm
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote cirrus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2015 at 3:21pm
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Tppa is here. MFAT ---ministry of foreign affairs and trade say tppa effectivly prevents any future ban on foreign buying of property here. Labour worried -Joyce defiant .
I would have preferred to keep our sovereignty.

Fly the Flag at half mast.

New flag should be white.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Capt Asparagus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2015 at 3:49pm
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Ya reckon? Seems to be pretty good all in all, at least to me. Perhaps I am not sufficiently paranoid. I mean, we didnt get everything, like the dairy thing could have been better, but hell, it is 20% better than what was before tpp instead of 50% better if we'd got the dairy side deal we wanted. It is still a win.
I suspect the world will not end, and that nz will not be labelled "Property of the USA" on any maps just yet....after all, if 11 other countries all signd up, they surely ALL cannot be dupes to the capitalist swine in the west surely?
Maybe.....just maybe.... the anti tpp groups over-cooked things just a leeeeetle?
After all, the main leader of the opposition to TPPA seemed to be Chicken Little, wasn't it?
It is only my overwhelming natural humility that mars my perfection.

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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Glaucus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2015 at 3:57pm
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Originally posted by Tone E Tone E wrote:

We will lose our ability to be masters of our own country. This is the beginning of a one world government and everything will change for the worse for us, and for the better for the huge multi-national corporations. A small example...plain packaging for tobacco and those scary adverts will be illegal. Cheap generic medicines will be banned so medicine will cost lots more, and it will be illegal for us to keep GMO food out of NZ     

Will be interesting to see if the government will continue pursuing the "Smokefree by 2025" campaign that's been in place sometime. 
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Kevin.S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2015 at 4:23pm
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Originally posted by Glaucus Glaucus wrote:

Originally posted by Tone E Tone E wrote:

We will lose our ability to be masters of our own country. This is the beginning of a one world government and everything will change for the worse for us, and for the better for the huge multi-national corporations. A small example...plain packaging for tobacco and those scary adverts will be illegal. Cheap generic medicines will be banned so medicine will cost lots more, and it will be illegal for us to keep GMO food out of NZ     

Will be interesting to see if the government will continue pursuing the "Smokefree by 2025" campaign that's been in place sometime. 

One of the news reports said that there was an exemption on the tobacco industry being able to stop things like that, and the plain packaging.  But the honest truth is that no one has any idea what this thing actually says, and we are unlikely to know the truth about what it contains for years.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote cirrus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2015 at 4:56pm
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WE already do know that no restrictions on foreign property buying here.
Say farewell silver fern farms. Say farewell to countless dairy farms as Kiwi owners hit a debt wall.
If i was in the U.S ,china ,Japan i would be out here buying all i can. Auckland will snapped up. No more taxes on foreign buyers. They could sue govt for loss of profit. Forget about young kiwis buying a house in Auckland,or Tauranga. They will take their skills overseas to Australia.Their gain our loss.
WE all know how the U.S feels about GMO. That may very come here with Tppa. If that happens then kiss good bye to any point of sales difference N.Z products have had. It will be gone forever.
Meanwhile the man has sat and sat ,and taught us all about pony tails ,cuddly Pandas and crappy new flags.
None of that is in anyway relevant to the real world.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Southern_Jez Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2015 at 5:38pm
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To be fair Cirrus ... there arent any effective controls on foreign buyers anyway. 

We protest the Crafar farm sale to foreigners ... yet a week later we welcome a foreign white guy to buy up all he wants (James Cameron). When Shania Twain purchased a massive block of land in Central Otago there wasnt a peep about foreign ownership. Is it foreign ownership we have a problem with, or is it Chinese ownership?

The TPPA agreement goes both ways, if they can suit the NZ govt for loss of profits, our companies can do the same to their govt. Due to population disparities, we have a much larger profit to lose in their markets, therefore a lot more to gain via a lawsuit.

All this disregards the fact that China is not even a part of the TPPA and receives no new benefits because of it as we already have a separate agreement with China ... 


... but hey thats all just govt spin right ...
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote cirrus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2015 at 6:24pm
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Agree SJ. Was thinking more of all the talk, especially from labour ,as next election nears,of restricting foreign buyers & immigration. This probably has caused some to hold back,especially those wanting to do new builds not knowing if the buyers would be there a year or two down the track. This new ruling will give them renewed confidence  to invest. But time will tell.

And with Dairy tariffs still in place why was this ever signed.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Capt Asparagus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Oct 2015 at 11:26pm
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Because dairy is still a little better off, and beef, mutton, wine, horticulture etc etc are all way better off.
it is essential that NZ be on the inside of these trade blocs, rather than johnny precious sitting outside then whining about how all the other signatory countries seem to have freer access to the markets we need to thrive, or even to survive.
Will our laws in place to monitor foreign ownership be changed? No. We retain the same laws we have at the moment, but true, it restricts new laws apparently being imposed to prevent other signatory member residents investing in this country. But they still need to pass the same conditions to meet the foreign ownership requirements that they do at the moment.
But yes, it does obviously mean that we are all doomed.
In a couple of years when it actually comes into effect that is.... after the other countries all get it cleared thru their own governments. Because this thing is not a personal attack on NZs freedom, it affects all these countries the same. One of the biggest hurdles to it going thru at all will be getting it passed by the US..., they are none too likely to be very impressed with a lot of these trade terms either. No country has got everything it wants either, but that is what happens in negotiations.




It is only my overwhelming natural humility that mars my perfection.

Captain Asparagus, Superhero, Adventurer.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote pjc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 2015 at 8:34am
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Watching Aussie news and they positive no whining over here.no whinging over foreign ownership in fact real estate companies have signs saying welcome
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Capt Asparagus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 2015 at 9:43am
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The problem here is that the only press coverage had here in NZ has, until this deal has been done and the provisions have been announced, been disseminated by the radically opposed to international trade deals, political opposition parties looking to score points against the party in power, and the alarmists on the left and often the extreme right, the xenophobes and jingoistic mostly.
Once people get over themselves and actually think about it, why would ANY government sign a treaty so unrelievedly bad for their nation that it would preclude them from ever getting back into power again?
The media have drummed up the anti side of things enormously, as any "The End Is Nigh" story sells newspapers, and opposition parties climb on the band wagon to score politicall cheap shots, knowing that they will either never be in a position to have to face the reality of the situation(such as the greens and NZ first), or can always climb off their high horses when they do get into power (eg Labour) when they have to actually make the country work.
Imagine if this to thing turned out to be a boon for NZ exporters, manufacturers etc, but in five year say the greens and labour and winston get into power and decide to repudiate the deal. Businesses get shut out of markets or become marginally viable as the tariffs go back on to our products. Job losses, businesses close, no job growth, interest rates soar..., but hey, that'll all be good eh......
I am very anti Helen Clarke, can't stand the woman, but she was totally correct when she said the other day that as a small trading nation, we HAVE to be in these trade blocs, or we lose big time.
At least, that is how I see it.
It is only my overwhelming natural humility that mars my perfection.

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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote cirrus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 2015 at 9:43am
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 PJC Are you implying that New zealanders who are opposed to selling their country to foreign interests are whining. ?  I would have thought they have concern for their children and grandchildren ,their future in this land.
Australia has been exempt the provision of uncontrolled land sales. We have not.

Already our Govt has said that uncontrolled immigration has been used to keep wages down here.
N.Z the low wage economy . Just wait until the aspirations of the new immigrants begin to unravel.

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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Capt Asparagus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Oct 2015 at 9:55am
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PJC may not be, but I am, kinda. I think they are hypocrites. If they had a pope rtf or business t sell, and an off shore buyer would pay, say, 3mill for it, and the best a local buyer would pay is 2.5mill, then I bet you anything you like they will change their tune.
If as an aucklander, if you look to sell your house, will you be willing to drop 100k in a refusal to sell to an Asian....sorry, a foreign migrant, mustn't single out any ethnicities here eh.
If you say yes you will, then ..... lets just say...."Tui".
It is only my overwhelming natural humility that mars my perfection.

Captain Asparagus, Superhero, Adventurer.
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