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And we laughed at the USA!!

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    Posted: 06 Dec 2016 at 4:12pm
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http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11761231

So Key is gone. Not spilling a lot of tears about that personally, but now look at the options - 

One has been minister for police but in many minds was on the wrong side of the bars after some of what she did. A Pm with the nick name "Crusher"?? Maybe she could go and help lead the Philippines. Could be in her element there working with the current leader.

Another is someone that almost no one has ever heard of and has no public visibility. Might be OK, but since when did great PM"s come out of a total shadow? Suggests that charisma and ability to present NZ to the world might be a serious stretch.

The front runner is a man who by all accounts has a decent set of skills, but previously led his party to one of their worst ever election defeats. Could he really hold the party together with Collins and co maybe trying to destabilise him? 

Sort of leaves NZ with the Trump/Clinton conundrum. Which is the lesser of the evils. For me, Key had been there too long and got too arrogant. Bit like Aunty Helen and here 3 term government. Only trouble is that this is going to potentially empower some of the 'rogue elements' in our political space and we don't really need that at a time where the world is economically challenging.


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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote MacSkipper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Dec 2016 at 4:27pm
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Yes going to be interesting to watch the knives come out in National party now or later.  Not a fan of John Key at first, and is easy to find faults with his government but we could have done a lot worse and I don't see the other choices being great either.  I would rate him as OK all up.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote SaltyC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Dec 2016 at 5:25pm
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I think Keys strength and his greatest weakness was a lack of real political ideology. He just wanted to be PM so was completely poll driven. If it was a hard decision and the polls said it would loose votes he wouldn't do it, but he had no real ideology driving a specific political aim.

That meant once National had captured the middle ground they would stay in power until they did something to alienate that middle ground. The danger for them now is that none of the candidates for leader actually give them an equivalent person so the middle ground will be open to competition in the next election.

Collins would alienate almost all of it, English carries the baggage of his past and allows the opposition to fall back on the farming/National stereotype, he to me, is also a way better deputy than he could ever be a leader. And Coleman well, just who is he and what has he done. His TV persona is not great and he comes across a bit preachy to me.

The best they could do out of the current crop available to them would be a Joyce/English combination but I don't think Joyce is really interested and he definitely isn't interested enough to scrap for it.

Having said all that their saving grace is that Labour has Little, and he is still virtually unelectable outside the union movement.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote cirrus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Dec 2016 at 5:31pm
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Having read your post Dave i agree. Only one thing for it. Trump for P.MLOL  At least MPI would sit up and take notice. You could entice him with the promise of some good workup action.

English. Well he did lead them to a resounding defeat.If he were in charge the pace in the beehive would resemble peak hour Auckland traffic.

Crusher Collins. Crusher sounds more like a brand of fruit juice.Not a drop of dairy in her.

Coleman. Sounds like some unknown figure from the fossil fuel lobby.
Yep ,has to be Trump.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote pompey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Dec 2016 at 9:08am
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It will be an interesting election. May the Party with the best bribe win. Whoever wins, I think we will be in for a bit of a rough patch. House prices are way too high and the stock market is over valued. At the other end, wages for most workers are years behind and we are over run by immigrants , many who have cheated the system. Readjustment time could be 2017.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Southern_Jez Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Dec 2016 at 11:17am
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At risk of being hunted down and having my wetsuit filled with concrete for my next dive ... this could empower someone like Gareth Morgan's party come next election (they just released their first policy on Tax reform).

Whatever happens in National it will get people looking at policies and reading "stuff" (not the website), it might then occur to them that the crazy cat man actually has some good ideas.

As for National, Coleman or English may pull it off, but Collins would make their jobs a living hell. I suspect Collins will get it just cause the others couldn't be bothered with the repercussions of beating her to it.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Kevin.S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Dec 2016 at 11:32am
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Nice summary Tagit, they are in a tricky situation with no obvious successor and none of the options look great.  I can't really see Collins in the role, one of the main reasons National have done so well recently is that Key was "likable" and appealed to many people -never saw the appeal myself, but plenty did.  I don't think anyone has ever described Collins as likable.  Hardly anyone has ever heard of Coleman so I expect they will end up with English.  But he's hardly a charismatic sort of person, always seemed pretty dull to me.  Could be English v Little for the next PM then, dull and duller -can't see that being an exciting battle.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote pompey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Dec 2016 at 11:37am
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The real worry is that the hole left by Key's resignation leaves voters thinking that someone like Gareth Morgan is an option. Luckily Colin Craig launch his run a term too early or we could be contemplating that crackpot too.

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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote cirrus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Dec 2016 at 11:45am
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A dash of Colemans mustard and he might be the next hot thing.

Or maybe the voter might let the Cat out of the bag  and vote Gareth. arrgh
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Snuffit. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Dec 2016 at 1:19pm
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^saw what you did there, Cirrus. LOL
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote The Tamure Kid Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Dec 2016 at 2:43pm
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Yip it's going to be an interesting year. Key was from the H Clark school of pragmatism - keeping that massive Auckland party vote middle ground happy. And also Labour's biggest nightmare, a state house/solo mum kid made good. No wonder he had Cullen (who went to Christ's, funnily enough) yelling at him "rich pri*k" in Parliament).
At least Little had the courtesy to acknowledge Key's service - unlike old mate Winston.
Speaking of which, the Northland snapper fisho will be licking his lips, as most commentators agree a Key-less National stands almost no chance of governing alone. So we'd be looking at Labour + Greens + Mana/Maori + NZ First. If Winston holds the balance of power, and we have Green "co-deputy PMs" for the first time, you'd want to have bought your US dollars well ahead of the post-election mess.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote SaltyC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Dec 2016 at 2:57pm
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^^or left the country!
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (1) Likes(1)   Quote Tagit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Dec 2016 at 7:59pm
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If Winnie gets any sort of position of power I'm moving to the US.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote The Tamure Kid Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Dec 2016 at 10:12pm
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Crystal ball gazing, I can see him as Attorney General in Cabinet, back accepting his famous "baubles of office" in return for his coalition support.

I still find it weird that he somehow ended up as one of the very rare 'Right Honourable' lifetime title holders other than Prime Ministers. 
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Kevin.S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Dec 2016 at 10:59pm
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Originally posted by Tagit Tagit wrote:

If Winnie gets any sort of position of power I'm moving to the US.

Don't want to worry you but I saw this poll the other day

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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote MacSkipper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Dec 2016 at 4:30am
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Originally posted by Kevin.S Kevin.S wrote:

Originally posted by Tagit Tagit wrote:

If Winnie gets any sort of position of power I'm moving to the US.

Don't want to worry you but I saw this poll the other day

Kevin you gotta be kidding!  I am booking a ticket now!
Good fishing trip nothing breaks, great trip catch fish.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Grumpy_old_Git Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Dec 2016 at 7:54am
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God help us if that man Peters gets any power. Unlike all the other politicians he didn't have the common decency to acknowledge Key's contribution and most of what he spouts is for media attention and not because it means anything.

He belongs in a home for the bewildered.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote mowerman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Dec 2016 at 7:56am
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wouldnt it be exciting  Winston our PM 
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote The Tamure Kid Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Dec 2016 at 9:00am
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I interviewed him once when I was a reasonably junior reporter back in the early 1990s. He had just done his thing at a Grey Power event, preaching to the converted, and afterwards shaking hands, all smiles and charm to the oldies.
As soon as he left the building (he actually said "let's get out of here") he switched persona to calculating and shrewd, lighting up a cigarette and never giving a straight answer. 
I wouldn't mind betting that this very long game he's played into his 70s is still based in part on revenge against the National Party that he once was an MP for. All the while creaming the old-style super scheme they have, all the allowances and travel perks.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (1) Likes(1)   Quote Grumpy_old_Git Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Dec 2016 at 9:10am
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Originally posted by mowerman mowerman wrote:

wouldnt it be exciting  Winston our PM 
Here's two more for the funny farm along with Winnie ->mowerman and gareth Morgan
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