The Fishing Website : Discussion Forums : Help with top water Q's https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/ Fri, 05 Jun 2026 20:00:15 +0000 Wed, 11 Sep 2013 18:35:56 +0000 http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss Web Wiz Forums 12.01 360 https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/RSS_post_feed.asp?TID=94079 <![CDATA[The Fishing Website : Discussion Forums]]> https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_images/web_wiz_forums.png https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/ <![CDATA[Help with top water Q's : Yeah Zac I&#039;m simply not experienced...]]> https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=94079&PID=1349029&title=help-with-top-water-qs#1349029 Author: PE Pete
Subject: 94079
Posted: 11 Sep 2013 at 6:35pm

Yeah Zac I'm simply not experienced with the rod but have two charters booked for next month so hope to learn more about my gear & this style of fishing in general. Good to hear an encouraging voice & will update this thread once I have done the charters. Hopefully with good news & maybe some pics.
Cheers Pete]]> Wed, 11 Sep 2013 18:35:56 +0000 https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=94079&PID=1349029&title=help-with-top-water-qs#1349029 <![CDATA[Help with top water Q's : mate the offshores are great...]]> https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=94079&PID=1349024&title=help-with-top-water-qs#1349024 Author: ELEVAR
Subject: 94079
Posted: 11 Sep 2013 at 6:23pm

mate the offshores are great rods but the ratings are up the wack, the max id cast with mine would be 165 absolute MAX! it works stick baits even as far down to 60g, ideal I find is around 100g, min is an illusion 76 assuming yours is the same.. a bit soft for poppers the 7ft 6 ones, but epic rods for the coin!!
 
zac
]]> Wed, 11 Sep 2013 18:23:57 +0000 https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=94079&PID=1349024&title=help-with-top-water-qs#1349024 <![CDATA[Help with top water Q's : You&#039;re right there LBD that...]]> https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=94079&PID=1348970&title=help-with-top-water-qs#1348970 Author: fishntips
Subject: 94079
Posted: 11 Sep 2013 at 4:02pm

You're right there LBD that you'll get the most out of your lures when you tie the leader directly to them. Damn straight. Every movement of the line and rod translates to the movements in the lure. But of course it's an issue when you want to change your lures regularly.

When you start adding split rings, swivels etc. it creates loose points of movement, making it not as effective for working sensitive lures. In the picture below you show multiple loose points of movement; from the split ring to the loop, the swivel to split ring, the swivel itself and the swivel to the thimble, all creating loose points of movement in your connection to the lure.

As you state the "standard practice around the world" in using swivels this way is not for the swivel to be an essential twisting part of the connection, but rather for the swivel providing a point for the split ring and leader to attach to. Poppers don't mind swivels too much but sensitive floating stickbaits do, which are the best in my opinion for targeting kingfish. If you run a thimble, a grommet or plastic tubing, there is no real need for a swivel. And if your lure is swimming right; not spinning, there isn't going to be any line twist. So why use it?

I was privileged to have a somewhat broken conversation with Konishisan a few years back about connecting topwater lures, where the summation was No Swivel = Good, Swivel = No Good.









]]> Wed, 11 Sep 2013 16:02:34 +0000 https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=94079&PID=1348970&title=help-with-top-water-qs#1348970 <![CDATA[Help with top water Q's : Hey Laidback as you have pointed...]]> https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=94079&PID=1348770&title=help-with-top-water-qs#1348770 Author: PE Pete
Subject: 94079
Posted: 11 Sep 2013 at 6:48am

Hey Laidback as you have pointed out some lures will take a mod others won't. Having read all the responses for which I am great full I have realized like most styles of fishing there really aren't rules as such but there are many opinions & that rod, reel line class lure style & weight etc ect all contribute to the success or otherwise of your efforts. I done things a bit arse about face & have ended up with a great rod for poppers & a collection of stick baits. So at this stage will simply relax & purservere with the gear I have & be grateful for what I have.
Thanks to all who have contributed above. Pete]]> Wed, 11 Sep 2013 06:48:17 +0000 https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=94079&PID=1348770&title=help-with-top-water-qs#1348770 <![CDATA[Help with top water Q's : Fish Pimp wrote: petethemeat...]]> https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=94079&PID=1348757&title=help-with-top-water-qs#1348757 Author: laidbackdood
Subject: 94079
Posted: 11 Sep 2013 at 2:18am

Originally posted by Fish Pimp Fish Pimp wrote:

Originally posted by petethemeat petethemeat wrote:

Originally posted by fish i fish i wrote:


You'll find it near impossible to swim stickbaits with a swivel, all good for poppers thou. 
Can you explain that?
 
On some Stick Baits you will find a swivel makes the lure spiral/roll to much when it should dive wiggle and pop. (Floating models )
Much better imo to tie direct to lure with a little Leader sleeve from (Jig Star) to protect the leader from being squashed under pressure.
Personally i have fished all my stickbaits and poppers with either a 8 or 9 mm owner split ring and a size 1 NT swivel and they have all worked well....except for carpenters which need to be tied direct.Even fished waxwings that way too....easy to change over....That is pretty standard practice around the world....swivel and split ring/split ring pliers.The fact you like jigging makes pliers a "No Brainer".....Berkley do a cheap set that are reliable and do the job.
Colin....Do you mean that red sleeve from jigstar?
If i use trebles...I use barbless......squashing barbs doesnt always work well and can still catch.
I like those in line shogun hooks esp for reel appeal lures and have used them on starwalker and shimano ocea pencils with a good action.......some poppers just need trebles unfortunately to balance out like has been said..
I have a few stickbaits i use a treble on the belly and and a big shogun on the tail.....pays to ask the best way to rig...when you buy them......Good luckWinkHere are a few...these caps are good too.
Hope this helps

RAL lure Shogun in line hooks.

Owner caps

Bit of a gap in this split ring..watch for that(replace)

Baker rig with cable tie

Crimp and plastic tubing(from bunnings)
]]> Wed, 11 Sep 2013 02:18:56 +0000 https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=94079&PID=1348757&title=help-with-top-water-qs#1348757 <![CDATA[Help with top water Q's : I always buy lures to match the...]]> https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=94079&PID=1347754&title=help-with-top-water-qs#1347754 Author: Legacy
Subject: 94079
Posted: 08 Sep 2013 at 12:56pm

I always buy lures to match the rod I'm using,or a rod to fish the weight of lures I want to use; I don't know much about that offshore but maybe buy some  nice heavy orions and maybe some 150gr poppers , use the rod for what its designed for , especially as a newby . Hopefully Ben or someone will lend you  a classic kiwi stickbaiting rod so you can see the difference.
]]> Sun, 08 Sep 2013 12:56:11 +0000 https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=94079&PID=1347754&title=help-with-top-water-qs#1347754 <![CDATA[Help with top water Q's : petethemeat wrote: fish...]]> https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=94079&PID=1347750&title=help-with-top-water-qs#1347750 Author: Fish Pimp
Subject: 94079
Posted: 08 Sep 2013 at 12:36pm

Originally posted by petethemeat petethemeat wrote:

Originally posted by fish i fish i wrote:


You'll find it near impossible to swim stickbaits with a swivel, all good for poppers thou. 
Can you explain that?
 
On some Stick Baits you will find a swivel makes the lure spiral/roll to much when it should dive wiggle and pop. (Floating models )
Much better imo to tie direct to lure with a little Leader sleeve from (Jig Star) to protect the leader from being squashed under pressure.
]]> Sun, 08 Sep 2013 12:36:45 +0000 https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=94079&PID=1347750&title=help-with-top-water-qs#1347750 <![CDATA[Help with top water Q's : fish i wrote:You&#039;ll find...]]> https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=94079&PID=1347709&title=help-with-top-water-qs#1347709 Author: petethemeat
Subject: 94079
Posted: 08 Sep 2013 at 10:28am

Originally posted by fish i fish i wrote:


You'll find it near impossible to swim stickbaits with a swivel, all good for poppers thou. 
Can you explain that?
]]> Sun, 08 Sep 2013 10:28:04 +0000 https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=94079&PID=1347709&title=help-with-top-water-qs#1347709 <![CDATA[Help with top water Q's : Ignore the cast ratings on those...]]> https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=94079&PID=1347690&title=help-with-top-water-qs#1347690 Author: fish i
Subject: 94079
Posted: 08 Sep 2013 at 9:39am

Ignore the cast ratings on those offshores, they are well out of whack. Who wants to cast around 300g lures anyhow. That rod you've got is essentially a popper rod, the lighter version illusion is more for stickbaits.
You'll find it near impossible to swim stickbaits with a swivel, all good for poppers thou. Mind you you'll have a hard time swimming stick baits w that rod anyhow. A good alternative I've found for swapping out lures is connecting your leader to a brass grommet and your split ring goes through that. Others use a bit of plastic tubing looped around and their split through that.

Essentially you've got a good set up for chasing tropical species and the odd king. But if it's kingfish you are mostly focussed on I'd swap that rod out for something more suited to working stickbaits.
]]> Sun, 08 Sep 2013 09:39:07 +0000 https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=94079&PID=1347690&title=help-with-top-water-qs#1347690 <![CDATA[Help with top water Q's : Yeah cheers Aaron it does make...]]> https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=94079&PID=1347671&title=help-with-top-water-qs#1347671 Author: PE Pete
Subject: 94079
Posted: 08 Sep 2013 at 8:08am

Yeah cheers Aaron it does make sense to me to do charters for many reasons not least to learn off the skipper & other anglers. Also get a lot out of discussions in here as well.
Pete]]> Sun, 08 Sep 2013 08:08:27 +0000 https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=94079&PID=1347671&title=help-with-top-water-qs#1347671