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Yamaha F150 Owners - READ

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    Posted: 22 Jun 2014 at 9:47pm
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In 2005 we bought a new Yamaha F200 for our fleet. A little later we bought a pair of F150's. Within a few years we were hit in the F200 with the now famous Yamaha oil seal and exhaust corrosion issues. This turned out to be major issues for 100's (1000's maybe) of owners, whilst Yamaha did their best Ostritch impression when confronted with the growing evidence. It appears that there are now class action legal suits under way in the US regarding this issue. 

The F150's though have run well for 900 hours until a wee alarm popped up the other day. It is a low oil pressure warning. The engine runs and sounds fine apart from a miss around 2000rpm which is a 'safe mode' type action that happens when the oil pressure alarm is active. When the alarm isn't active (mostly isn't) the engine runs like new one. Based on what I was seeing and hearing I figured it was a faulty oil pressure sender, but won't know for sure until we put a mechanical oil pressure gauge on it next week. 

This weekend I started looking around the web for a parts supplier. We get 80% of our parts off shore now due to the high margins often applied by the NZ dealers (not just Yamaha - actually they aren't as bad as some others in this regard), so did the rounds of the guys we normally use plus googled for any new ones. WELL, googling Yamaha F150 oil pressure quickly became a very scary thing to do. No, I didn't end up at websites involving donkeys, goats and naked bodies. What I did find is that there is a very serious issue with the F150 that if you own one you need to be aware of. 

On the F150 there is a 'counterbalancer' unit which helps smooth out your engine. As I understand it, it has plastic gears that eventually tear apart and fill your oil passages with debris. It seems that the most common reported issue is that the screen in front of the oil pump gets clogged, so catch it in time and you can hopefully avoid any damage. The first sign is often a slight whining noise (haven't heard that in ours), and the next sign is the oil pressure alarm, or a destroyed engine. Some independent commentators on this say that this is not a 'will it happen to my engine' problem, but a 'WHEN will it happen to my engine' problem. The bit of reading I did found cases that happened anywhere from 30 hours or use to over 1000 hours, and anywhere in between. Seem to remember there was one case mentioned on a 2010 F150, so not sure what years are affected, but it would appear that the fix might have come a long time after the problem started showing up.

If you are an F150 owner I would love to know if you have had this problem, and if you haven't had it, have your service guys told you to watch out for it? This appears like it might be another 'Ostritch' response, but maybe we just didn't get the letter. 

So if you are an F150 owner, google Yamaha F150 oil pressure and have a read. There are even some youtube videos that demonstrate the whining sound you need to listen out for if you are lucky enough to catch it before losing your engine. If you do have a higher hours F150 and like to go wide, have a good think about whether some preventative maintenance might be a good idea.

I am going to do a proper oil pressure test on our engine this week. Then pull the counterbalance units off both of them for inspection. If the oil pressure is low on the bad engine I am pretty sure that we have caught it before there is any real damage, but the fix will be pulling off the powerhead, cleaning the oil pump screen, then doing some fluffing around to clean out the oil passages as best we can, and finally fitting a new counterbalance unit. I can't tell you how much I hate paying these companies for parts to replace things that they designed wrong in the first place. Not only do they let you down with their quality, they then go on to make extra profit from doing it. It is just a morally bankrupt attitude as I see it. Altogether another $1000 or so and a couple of days work which could have been avoided if we had known a bit earlier that the counterbalance units are badly designed. Don't like to think what it might cost of you just drive it in to your local Yamaha shop. If anyone knows I would love to find out.


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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote full sacks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Jun 2014 at 10:05pm
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have thanked you there dave don't own one but now people with, back in my engine building days mitsi engines had issues with these shafts, are the replacements constructed in the same material ? hate this sort of crap, yep that google is bloody good tool for that stuff good luck chief.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote plastic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Jun 2014 at 11:31pm
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I was just reading about the counter balance shafts on hull truth last night. there have been four new generation fixes for this problem and still they fail. utube has videos of engines with and without the balance shafts and no noticible difference in vibration, I think they remove the gears so the shafts dont turn but keep the oil passage holes blocked. Price in usa is around $380 and small socket set required. Classic tell tale  is a chirping sound at idle. Counter balance shafts quite common on 4 cylinder engines over 2.5 liter
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Tagit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 2014 at 1:50pm
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Will bump this for a few days until hopefully everyone who needs to read it has.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote coxie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 2014 at 5:45pm
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Yep mitsubishi engines are well known to have problems with their balance shafts, and in the few mitsi engines I have built they have been removed altogether, from memory just install the bearings at a different rotation to block off the oil gallery.
You'd think with a problem like this with a company like Yamaha they would put out a recall or something to get it remedied before it has a chance to ruin the brands reputation...
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote rahui Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 2014 at 6:20pm
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does this happen across there whole range of 4 strokes
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Tagit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 2014 at 6:45pm
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Different issues on different models Rahui. As far as I can find out only the F150 has this balancer issue.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote full sacks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 2014 at 7:49pm
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yep bang on coxie , rahui don't think they will be in the smaller displacement stuff. just had a look dave it seems she's a bolt on job to the crankcase, can see how they fail two shafts threw one gear running twice as fast THE BALANCE SHAFTS NEED BALANCE SHAFTS.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote pompey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 2014 at 8:14pm
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Got me worried . I have 2012 F150. Seems like the problem still exists even in the newer models?
Thanks for bringing this to our attention,
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Ballsout Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 2014 at 8:17pm
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Who dose all your engine servicing tagit
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote kaveman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 2014 at 8:22pm
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OMG, these motors were regarded as the best of there HP range.

Next stop..... Honda for me
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Capt Asparagus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 2014 at 8:38pm
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Chatting to one who knows today, suggests just removing the whole balancer thingie.

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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote krow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 2014 at 8:47pm
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I haven't got one either but I know someone who has just brought the very latest model and wonder if this too could be the same block? 
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Tagit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 2014 at 9:03pm
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I don't know Krow. Get him to google up the specs and check it out. I suspect however that Yamaha might have fixed this by now, but like with many of these semi-generic Yamaha issues they are not great at distributing that information. I guess saying that you have fixed something would involve admitting that it was broken in the first place, and that might have consequences should another class action get launched. 
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote DezzyTooToo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 2014 at 10:20pm
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Originally posted by kaveman kaveman wrote:

OMG, these motors were regarded as the best of there HP range.

 
Only in the eyes of Yammy and Mercury owners   Big smile
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote DezzyTooToo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 2014 at 10:24pm
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Originally posted by DezzyTooToo DezzyTooToo wrote:

Originally posted by kaveman kaveman wrote:

OMG, these motors were regarded as the best of there HP range.

 
Only in the eyes of Yammy and Mercury owners   Big smile
 
 
That wasn`t very compassionate of me ....
 
I`d be fork`n` gutted if I had one of those 150`s`and read that about it .
 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Kings Marine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Jun 2014 at 9:04pm
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Yep done several F150 Yams with that and other common problems that havent been raised yet.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (1) Likes(1)   Quote RC1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Jun 2014 at 9:21pm
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All outboard makes and models have certain parts that wear out than others, I think in this case Yamaha have been really good and most of them have been taken care of under warranty. With all these late model engines it does really pay to have them serviced at a local dealership or someone who has a close affiliation with a dealership in this case Yamaha therefore any issues should be rectified as per service bulletins when the engines get serviced.

Tagit you must not get your engines serviced at a Yamaha dealership, if these had failed while the engine was out of warranty, it should be in Yamahas best interest to get the engines repaired.

Kaveman, the Honda BF150 also has a balancer shaft. Will you still go Honda Wink

Guys you have nothing to worry about your F150 balancer shafts, I would however say and recommend use your Yamaha dealership or Yamaha trained serviceman who has an affiliation with a Yamaha dealer, not just any old service business for servicing, that way if something goes wrong it will get repaired and any issues will be sorted.

Any questions please feel free to pm me,

Cheers Russ
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Tagit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Jun 2014 at 9:52pm
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Hmmm, last time I 'talked' (wrote) to Yamaha about a known issue with one of our engines they didn't bother responding. Owned lots of Yamaha's back then so was very disappointed. In fact, in that particular case it seems that their service agents weren't getting given much information either aye Russ Wink. Now a class action suit launched in the US, so I guess they didn't quite get that one right.

I would be interested to hear from any F150 owners who have had their Yamaha service agent proactively warn them to watch out for signs of the balancer failing. From the public info available it sounds like waiting for the next 100 hour service after the problem starts with a slight whining noise may be too late? If going to a Yamaha agent doesn't get the information passed on to you before your engine fails, I can't see how that is going to help very much? The reality is that it wouldn't take much for Yamaha to write to the original owners of these engines and pass on the warning, but that would mean admitting some sort of liability I expect. As for getting your Yamaha repaired out of warranty, it seems that it does occasionally happen, but there seem to be lots more owners out there who didn't get help than there are who did. Which of course then raises the question as to why some did get help and why many others did not. Seems like a rather bad way of managing your customers really.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote RC1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Jun 2014 at 10:11pm
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Thumbs Up  well said techo, I agree


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