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Recreational Fishing Licences - have your say

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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote cirrus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jan 2017 at 9:33pm
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Originally posted by Tagit Tagit wrote:

We need to accept that for as long as the government see themselves better off aligning with the comm sector, the rec sector will continue to lose ground. We have a major issue in population growth that nothing in the current QMS or government attitudes will fix. 
The only true fix is going to be when the government finally believe that it is in their own personal best interests to align themselves and their decision making with the rec community. That means that until they truly fear the backlash from future decisions that go against the rec community, they will continue with their current process of supporting the commercial industry at the rec industries expense. Right now they still back themselves to produce enough 'spin' to confuse enough people in the rec community to make any backlash negligible. 
The release of their Fishing Park plan at the last minute during the last election campaign was a classic example. There were people on these forums and all over the place saying what a great thing the government was doing. As we now know, these proposals were not properly thought through and are probably now going to be implemented at significant cost to the rec community (again). Even all the various study forums etc being implemented by council and government badly marginalise the rec community by design.
Bottom line is that the only real solution for rec fishing is to get the government making decisions that properly reflect the importance of rec fishing to the people of this country. That is only going to happen once we have a decent degree of unity amongst ourselves.

As I mentioned before, why would this government implement a recreational fishing licence so that the rec community could have enough funds to properly challenge the government and comm industry through the courts? The only reason will be if we can make them politically uncomfortable enough to question whether there are too many votes at risk for them to carry on as they are.
  Tagit wrote.

"We need to accept that for as long as the government see them selves aligning with the comm sector,the rec sector will continue to lose ground."

That sort of thing has been going on for a long time.

Quote   " The government which was designed for the people,has got into the hands of the bosses and their employers,the special interests. An invisible empire has been set up above the forms of Democracy."

Woodrow Wilson. U.S president 1913-1921.

So  what has changed in all that time.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (1) Likes(1)   Quote LegaSea Community Builder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Jan 2017 at 8:55am
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Originally posted by Tzer Tzer wrote:

Originally posted by LegaSea Community Builder LegaSea Community Builder wrote:

Originally posted by Tzer Tzer wrote:

Originally posted by John H John H wrote:

]MB
LegaSea is not doing nothing.  See our Annual Report

The profile of recreational fishing in NZ has never been higher.
We supported a feature film on Recreational fishing on the Kiapara Harbour called THE CATCH on in cinemas now.  Last night there was an hour long ITM Fishing Show featuring LegaSea on prime time TV1 and a paid TV ad.

We have a Fish Care campaign starting soon and have been talking to politicians in the build up to election year. 

What you can do is sign up as a LegaSea Legend to make LegaSea more effective.

Or keep up to date with WHAT IS BEING DONE by subscribing for free


John so what has Legasea actually achieved for recreational fishes of NZ. All I seemed to read is a lot of Pr rhetoric.

If I could help answer, John will probably also have his own comments.

A voice. Evident by the growing support from individuals and industry and submissions to govt.      
The What's Fishing Worth study was a landmark achievement. In other countries the same type of report brought about policy changes and developments that valued rec fishing. Establishing the economic value of rec fishing has never been accomplished before. We have always been trying to convince govt of the economic benefits of rec fishing without being able to give hard data. We have the facts now to back up the arguments. 
From my perspective, part of the reason I joined LegaSea was because I could see an advocacy group becoming more organised and recognised and I couldn't remember seeing that before through out the last 40yrs of my rec fishing history. There have been organised fights like Option 4, but the reach, longevity and community getting behind LegaSea is in a whole different league now.



All well and good Scott, yes there's is a voice for recreational ( lets not forget the NZRFC is also supposed to represent the public of NZ), a face book page that apart from some helpful info the rest is either propaganda BS or full of the sort of crap you find on other social media pages and submissions made regarding fishery management. There is very little else that I see that Legasea has actually achieved to show affiliated NZSFC club members or the public that they are working for them.

LegaSea people were also involved in the Striped Marlin not for sale campaign that saw marlin being a rec only catch. They were also involved in limiting how much kingfish could be harvested by comms years ago. Both those fisheries rank on the world stage - NZ have some of the biggest striped marlin in the world and we hold something like 32 out of the 34 records for kingfish. Legasea people were also involved in the kahawai legal challenge. Those are tangible outcomes for rec fishers. Maybe the question everyone should ask themselves is - what would rec fishing look like if LegaSea wasn't in existence? Who would step up? Who would get behind them? It's obvious lots of unhappy or concerned individuals don't make a difference to Govt until they are speaking with one voice. 
Forgive me if I haven't read your post correctly but it looks like you're calling the whats fishing worth study BS and propaganda. Considering the same study has been done in other countries and had success, calling it BS/propaganda would be false as it has shown the value of rec fishing and govt's in other countries not captured by the commercial industry have had the sense to see the value of rec fishing and help it grow accordingly. Mexico for example. You're entitled to your opinion however lets keep the trash talk out shall we? Unfortunately when the viewers see trash talk going on they lose respect for the talkers and it weakens the arguments of those who use it. Fewer people seem to be posting in the forums these days - quite possibly because of the trash talk, shame really because it's a good place to be a part of the rec fishing community.    
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  I am TOTALLY OPPOSED to any license for rec fishers.
 It does NOT work in Australia, in fact one senator lost his seat over the issue. Try,(before action by the Aussie fisher), $650 to row 100 yards offshore and attempt to catch a fish of any sort.
  New Zealand is a corrupt & openly racially divided country with Maori given special rights reguardless of Te Tirity O Waitangi.
  If anybody can remember law-abiding firearms owners were invited to purchase a new license to replace the 'Lifetime' one they had contrated with the state. This was to soften people up for the illegal 'Photo I.D. Drivers Licenses'. It had nothing to do with safty,(the Police had already deliberately armed all the serious career criminals), in order to further a fully armed Police Force.
  I consider it my BIRTHRIGHT to throw a line in the tide and catch anything I want to.

  Far better would be to honour Te Tirity O Waitangi, Article the Thrid, get rid of racially designated 'Customary' fishing & ban most commercial fishing from within 12 Nauticle Miles of shore, ban all foreign vessels from our waters with a surrender or sink policey,(would need a working Navy & Air Force), investigate flexible local bans in spawning areas during peak activity & slap serious fishing offenders hard.

  I for one won't be voting for the National Facist Party, Labour for Nothing Party or any race based party of liers & theives come the election.
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Totally agree that The Australian model is very different in that Sydney for example has the population of N.Z in one city. Big difference in population and big difference in funds available,for example to buy back commercial quota from Sydney harbour.

Yet on the plus side the harbour and coast outside the heads has rebounded in way way that has to be seen to be believed.


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Originally posted by cirrus cirrus wrote:

Totally agree that The Australian model is very different in that Sydney for example has the population of N.Z in one city. Big difference in population and big difference in funds available,for example to buy back commercial quota from Sydney harbour.

Yet on the plus side the harbour and coast outside the heads has rebounded in way way that has to be seen to be believed.
Spot on Cirrus,
Before the coms buyout of Sydney Harbour, I was on a bus everyday going over the iron cove bridge, watching countless trawlers cruise up the harbour and catch everything they could all night, every night, destroying the seabed in the process.

Now there are massive bait balls everywhere, including under the harbour bridge.Big smile

With such a small population in NZ, and less than 1 million fishos, its almost impossible to generate enough cash to make any difference.Shocked

money talks, a few thousand angry fishermen on one fishing website forum won't make any significant change, sorryCry
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[/QUOTE]
With such a small population in NZ, and less than 1 million fishos, its almost impossible to generate enough cash to make any difference.[/QUOTE]

I wouldn't be so dismissive of what licensing can do based upon the population of NZ. The population of WA is considerably less then NZ (2.6M vs 4.6M) and the general consensus from anglers over here is that they are quite satisfied with what has been able to be achieved with the revenue raised from licences.   
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (1) Likes(1)   Quote Tzer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jan 2017 at 6:03pm
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Originally posted by LegaSea Community Builder LegaSea Community Builder wrote:

Originally posted by Tzer Tzer wrote:

Originally posted by LegaSea Community Builder LegaSea Community Builder wrote:

Originally posted by Tzer Tzer wrote:

Originally posted by John H John H wrote:

]MB
LegaSea is not doing nothing.  See our Annual Report

The profile of recreational fishing in NZ has never been higher.
We supported a feature film on Recreational fishing on the Kiapara Harbour called THE CATCH on in cinemas now.  Last night there was an hour long ITM Fishing Show featuring LegaSea on prime time TV1 and a paid TV ad.

We have a Fish Care campaign starting soon and have been talking to politicians in the build up to election year. 

What you can do is sign up as a LegaSea Legend to make LegaSea more effective.

Or keep up to date with WHAT IS BEING DONE by subscribing for free


John so what has Legasea actually achieved for recreational fishes of NZ. All I seemed to read is a lot of Pr rhetoric.

If I could help answer, John will probably also have his own comments.

A voice. Evident by the growing support from individuals and industry and submissions to govt.      
The What's Fishing Worth study was a landmark achievement. In other countries the same type of report brought about policy changes and developments that valued rec fishing. Establishing the economic value of rec fishing has never been accomplished before. We have always been trying to convince govt of the economic benefits of rec fishing without being able to give hard data. We have the facts now to back up the arguments. 
From my perspective, part of the reason I joined LegaSea was because I could see an advocacy group becoming more organised and recognised and I couldn't remember seeing that before through out the last 40yrs of my rec fishing history. There have been organised fights like Option 4, but the reach, longevity and community getting behind LegaSea is in a whole different league now.



All well and good Scott, yes there's is a voice for recreational ( lets not forget the NZRFC is also supposed to represent the public of NZ), a face book page that apart from some helpful info the rest is either propaganda BS or full of the sort of crap you find on other social media pages and submissions made regarding fishery management. There is very little else that I see that Legasea has actually achieved to show affiliated NZSFC club members or the public that they are working for them.

LegaSea people were also involved in the Striped Marlin not for sale campaign that saw marlin being a rec only catch. They were also involved in limiting how much kingfish could be harvested by comms years ago. Both those fisheries rank on the world stage - NZ have some of the biggest striped marlin in the world and we hold something like 32 out of the 34 records for kingfish. Legasea people were also involved in the kahawai legal challenge. Those are tangible outcomes for rec fishers. Maybe the question everyone should ask themselves is - what would rec fishing look like if LegaSea wasn't in existence? Who would step up? Who would get behind them? It's obvious lots of unhappy or concerned individuals don't make a difference to Govt until they are speaking with one voice. 
Forgive me if I haven't read your post correctly but it looks like you're calling the whats fishing worth study BS and propaganda. Considering the same study has been done in other countries and had success, calling it BS/propaganda would be false as it has shown the value of rec fishing and govt's in other countries not captured by the commercial industry have had the sense to see the value of rec fishing and help it grow accordingly. Mexico for example. You're entitled to your opinion however lets keep the trash talk out shall we? Unfortunately when the viewers see trash talk going on they lose respect for the talkers and it weakens the arguments of those who use it. Fewer people seem to be posting in the forums these days - quite possibly because of the trash talk, shame really because it's a good place to be a part of the rec fishing community.    


Scott, yes some Legasea people (now) may have been involved with what you mention but you cant claim that these are Legasea achievements. I am well aware if NZ status in the striped marlin & kingfish fishery but please don't take me for a fool which I take as your implying,  as for what the fishery would look like now if Legasea wasn't in existence, bit of a far reaching statement isn't it. I still fail to believe that NZ recreational fishery is in as bad a state as everyone makes out, certainly no here anyway. At no stage did I mention the  what's fishing worth study propaganda B/S, although I do have reservations about some of its findings. Trash talk? if you consider my opinions as such then so be it but then that's your prerogative. Maybe just maybe why people are being turned of posting in the forum is not because of "trash talk" but rather that this place has become to political and not a place of sharing & learning.
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Quote
I wouldn't be so dismissive of what licensing can do based upon the population of NZ. The population of WA is considerably less then NZ (2.6M vs 4.6M) and the general consensus from anglers over here is that they are quite satisfied with what has been able to be achieved with the revenue raised from licences.   

You cannot compare total population numbers with licence paying fishos.

I reckon there would easily be more saltwater fishing licence paying people in WA, than there would be in ALL of NZ. 

Was it around 900,000 regular fishos in NZ?

Minus all Maori - how many ?
minus pensioners - how many ?
those that just wont pay - how many ?

doesn't leave too many fisherpeople to fill the coffers does it.

I am very happy with what I have seen my fishing licence fees go towards.

Craig

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Originally posted by Fish Addict Fish Addict wrote:



With such a small population in NZ, and less than 1 million fishos, its almost impossible to generate enough cash to make any difference.[/QUOTE]

I wouldn't be so dismissive of what licensing can do based upon the population of NZ. The population of WA is considerably less then NZ (2.6M vs 4.6M) and the general consensus from anglers over here is that they are quite satisfied with what has been able to be achieved with the revenue raised from licences.   [/QUOTE]
Our coastline is way bigger than WA I'm sure.
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Seriously why are so many Australians commenting on our fishery?
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Its probably that little thing called ANZAC spirit Clutch plus the fact those boys fish and been through the process. 
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Originally posted by Clutch Clutch wrote:

Seriously why are so many Australians commenting on our fishery?

I think it is great that way we may learn from their mistakes and also how its is effected their fishing areas, pros/cons, advantages/disadvantages, comms pushed out, environmental monitoring, bureaucratic regulations and much more.

I personally cannot stand the idea for NZ but if it is inevitable then best we learn from those doing it and not re-invent the wheel and make it square! ... Just my ten centsOuch
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Originally posted by Clutch Clutch wrote:

Originally posted by Fish Addict Fish Addict wrote:



With such a small population in NZ, and less than 1 million fishos, its almost impossible to generate enough cash to make any difference.


I wouldn't be so dismissive of what licensing can do based upon the population of NZ. The population of WA is considerably less then NZ (2.6M vs 4.6M) and the general consensus from anglers over here is that they are quite satisfied with what has been able to be achieved with the revenue raised from licences.   [/QUOTE]
Our coastline is way bigger than WA I'm sure.
[/QUOTE]

Not so according to Wikipedia.
Western Australia has 20,781 km of coastline, including 7,892 km of island coastline.
NZ has 14,000 km of coastline.
Other sources say NZ coastline is closer to 15,000km.
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Originally posted by NumnuT_AUS NumnuT_AUS wrote:

Quote
I wouldn't be so dismissive of what licensing can do based upon the population of NZ. The population of WA is considerably less then NZ (2.6M vs 4.6M) and the general consensus from anglers over here is that they are quite satisfied with what has been able to be achieved with the revenue raised from licences.   


You cannot compare total population numbers with licence paying fishos.

I reckon there would easily be more saltwater fishing licence paying people in WA, than there would be in ALL of NZ. 

Was it around 900,000 regular fishos in NZ?

Minus all Maori - how many ?
minus pensioners - how many ?
those that just wont pay - how many ?

doesn't leave too many fisherpeople to fill the coffers does it.

I am very happy with what I have seen my fishing licence fees go towards.

Craig



Had you read the posts a few pages back you would have seen that the WA Dept of Fisheries reported that 170,094 licences were purchased during the 2014 / 2015 year. That number of licences represents less than 4% of the population of NZ. Seems doable to me.
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Originally posted by Catchelot Catchelot wrote:

Originally posted by Clutch Clutch wrote:

Seriously why are so many Australians commenting on our fishery?

I think it is great that way we may learn from their mistakes and also how its is effected their fishing areas, pros/cons, advantages/disadvantages, comms pushed out, environmental monitoring, bureaucratic regulations and much more.

I personally cannot stand the idea for NZ but if it is inevitable then best we learn from those doing it and not re-invent the wheel and make it square! ... Just my ten centsOuch
We should be using common sense. I couldn't care lees what Australians have done.
Get commercial fisherman out of the Hauraki Gulf. ##ck Australia.
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Originally posted by Clutch Clutch wrote:

Seriously why are so many Australians commenting on our fishery?


I was born and breed in NZ and spent the first 30 years of my life there. I want to make sure that when I return on holidays there are some fish left.
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Originally posted by Fish Addict Fish Addict wrote:

Originally posted by Clutch Clutch wrote:

Seriously why are so many Australians commenting on our fishery?


I was born and breed in NZ and spent the first 30 years of my life there. I want to make sure that when I return on holidays there are some fish left.
You deserted...I care not if you catch fish here.
I actually like Australia but they should have no impact or say on our fishery.
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Originally posted by Fish Addict Fish Addict wrote:

Originally posted by NumnuT_AUS NumnuT_AUS wrote:

Quote
I wouldn't be so dismissive of what licensing can do based upon the population of NZ. The population of WA is considerably less then NZ (2.6M vs 4.6M) and the general consensus from anglers over here is that they are quite satisfied with what has been able to be achieved with the revenue raised from licences.   


You cannot compare total population numbers with licence paying fishos.

I reckon there would easily be more saltwater fishing licence paying people in WA, than there would be in ALL of NZ. 

Was it around 900,000 regular fishos in NZ?

Minus all Maori - how many ?
minus pensioners - how many ?
those that just wont pay - how many ?

doesn't leave too many fisherpeople to fill the coffers does it.

I am very happy with what I have seen my fishing licence fees go towards.

Craig



Had you read the posts a few pages back you would have seen that the WA Dept of Fisheries reported that 170,094 licences were purchased during the 2014 / 2015 year. That number of licences represents less than 4% of the population of NZ. Seems doable to me.

Happy to be corrected, thanks - too lazy to google sorry.

If fishing licenses were brought into NZ, how many would be purchased & how many would be exempt?

Cheers
Craig
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If you follow Australian fishing both countries claim world leading technology fisheries,both are in the same boat,less stock.But what I have read WA is proberly worst than ours. So hopefully we can learn from their mistakes.at least we can still take 7 snapper in sna1 unlike WA where 2 or 3 is the limit with min/max sizes
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Originally posted by Clutch Clutch wrote:

I actually like Australia but they should have no impact or say on our fishery.

How much of a say do you have in your fishery?
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