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Make The Taupo Fishery the 13th Fish and Game Reg

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Category: Freshwater Fishing
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URL: https://www.fishing.net.nz/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=125053
Printed Date: 29 Mar 2024 at 8:55pm


Topic: Make The Taupo Fishery the 13th Fish and Game Reg
Posted By: gunangler
Subject: Make The Taupo Fishery the 13th Fish and Game Reg
Date Posted: 09 Aug 2017 at 9:15pm

Press release. 09/08/2017
NZ Outdoors Party

Make The Taupo Fishery the 13th Fish and Game Region.

"The Outdoors Party will seek to change management of the Taupo Fishery from the Department of Conservation to Fish And Game" said Co-Leader, Alan Simmons. The fishery would become the 13th Fish & Game region and come under local management by an elected council of local people.

Since 1990 New Zealand’s most iconic trout fishery has been managed separately by DoC, on behalf of the Crown, whilst the rest of the New Zealand freshwater fisheries have thrived under Fish and Game. Alan Simmons said "The Taupo fisheries team are under-funded, under-resourced and the fishery has suffered from a drop in license sales every year since to half of what it was. There is no communication with license holders and the Taupo Fisheries Advisory Committee, the anglers’ only opportunity to input into the fishery, has failed completely.”

In contrast, fisheries managed by Fish & Game are run by angler-elected Councillors and provide extensive research, communications and feedback for their license holders."

The Taupo Fishery is of vital importance to the region, bringing in upwards of ninety million dollars per year to the local economy, but has been pared to the bone by DoC, with rangers and fisheries scientists now largely absent.

"The Fish & Game model could allow for Ngāti Tūwharetoa, owners of the Taupo lake bed, to have permanent council positions and a much better say in managing a resource that has become very important with local Maori for both food and sports fishing." Alan Simmons said. "Now that the annual payments for the use of Lake Taupo are no longer tied to license sales there is no reason for the Department of Conservation to continue with a small marginalised management team at Taupo that does not fit with the Department’s preservationist culture."

The NZ Outdoors Party recognise that agreement of the Tūwharetoa Maori Trust Board is central to this proposal.

Ends
Alan Simmons
Co Leader
NZ Outdoors Party
Ph 07 386 7576
0274 980 304




Replies:
Posted By: MacSkipper
Date Posted: 10 Aug 2017 at 6:30am
Originally posted by gunangler gunangler wrote:

Press release. 09/08/2017
NZ Outdoors Party

Make The Taupo Fishery the 13th Fish and Game Region.

"The Outdoors Party will seek to change management of the Taupo Fishery from the Department of Conservation to Fish And Game" said Co-Leader, Alan Simmons. The fishery would become the 13th Fish & Game region and come under local management by an elected council of local people.

Since 1990 New Zealand’s most iconic trout fishery has been managed separately by DoC, on behalf of the Crown, whilst the rest of the New Zealand freshwater fisheries have thrived under Fish and Game. Alan Simmons said "The Taupo fisheries team are under-funded, under-resourced and the fishery has suffered from a drop in license sales every year since to half of what it was. There is no communication with license holders and the Taupo Fisheries Advisory Committee, the anglers’ only opportunity to input into the fishery, has failed completely.”

In contrast, fisheries managed by Fish & Game are run by angler-elected Councillors and provide extensive research, communications and feedback for their license holders."

The Taupo Fishery is of vital importance to the region, bringing in upwards of ninety million dollars per year to the local economy, but has been pared to the bone by DoC, with rangers and fisheries scientists now largely absent.

"The Fish & Game model could allow for Ngāti Tūwharetoa, owners of the Taupo lake bed, to have permanent council positions and a much better say in managing a resource that has become very important with local Maori for both food and sports fishing." Alan Simmons said. "Now that the annual payments for the use of Lake Taupo are no longer tied to license sales there is no reason for the Department of Conservation to continue with a small marginalised management team at Taupo that does not fit with the Department’s preservationist culture."

The NZ Outdoors Party recognise that agreement of the Tūwharetoa Maori Trust Board is central to this proposal.

Ends
Alan Simmons
Co Leader
NZ Outdoors Party
Ph 07 386 7576
0274 980 304

seems like a good idea?

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Good fishing trip nothing breaks, great trip catch fish.


Posted By: Fishb8
Date Posted: 10 Aug 2017 at 7:27am
As always, there is the 'power grab' mentality. DOC don't want to let go of a major asset. Truth is that DOC are not fishery managers and would be better off sticking to what they do best.
I believe F&G would do a better job.


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Be yourself; everyone else is already taken


Posted By: MB
Date Posted: 10 Aug 2017 at 9:40am
It is illogical that DOC run the Taupo fishery. It must cause them all sorts of existential angst managing an introduced/invasive species


Posted By: flyfisher
Date Posted: 10 Aug 2017 at 10:14am
Needs to be done and makes perfect sense, the doc Taupo management was always the "odd child" on the NZ freshwater scene... while they are at it, lump Rotoaira under the same umbrella, that's a mess of a mis-managed fishery!


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https://www.youtube.com/user/troutboynz


Posted By: wopass
Date Posted: 10 Aug 2017 at 11:27am
Originally posted by Fishb8 Fishb8 wrote:

As always, there is the 'power grab' mentality. DOC don't want to let go of a major asset. Truth is that DOC are not fishery managers and would be better off sticking to what they do best.
I believe F&G would do a better job.

yea like dropping 1080 on all of our land killing all the wildlife inc kiwi and into the lake all the waterways that lead into it...

Angry

F&G would do it better.


Posted By: makka
Date Posted: 10 Aug 2017 at 9:12pm
F&G wouldn't touch it with a barge pole


Posted By: gunangler
Date Posted: 10 Aug 2017 at 10:29pm
I'm Intrigued what the reasoning behind that statement is?Smile


Posted By: makka
Date Posted: 11 Aug 2017 at 1:19pm
Why would they take on a lot more work and headaches for little to no monetary gain?


Posted By: gunangler
Date Posted: 11 Aug 2017 at 1:30pm
F&G have tried three times to get it .... Smile but DoC are hanging on like a foxy clamped on a pigs balls.  It makes sense to use the expertise that F&G have in fisheries management and they are duly bound by the conservation act to advocate for sports fisheries. Another $1.5m in the coffers would not go amiss around the country. They will just have to look at the inter-availability issues.


Posted By: Snuffit.
Date Posted: 11 Aug 2017 at 3:28pm
Another $1.5m revenue would be soaked up in a re-structure easily... Alan do you then incorporate Taupo into Eastern, or A/W, or do you set it up as a new region with another CEO (making 14 in total in the F&G setup!), another council... the revenue's not theirs anyway because it goes into a central pot for distribution against operational budgets... 

Just saying its not simply a matter of picking it up and saying "here boys, its yours..." as you well know. It needs to be planned pretty damn carefully. Is that what your party intends to do?




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You cant eat my toast fish


Posted By: makka
Date Posted: 11 Aug 2017 at 3:32pm
You can be pretty sure that at this point in time they would want nothing to do with taupo, not to mention the problems that come with it.

Where did you pull the $1.5m of extra revenue figure from?

Have you consulted F&G about this or just decided on it yourself?


Posted By: gunangler
Date Posted: 11 Aug 2017 at 3:49pm
Taupo used to generate 1.5m but has dropped by half under doc management. 
Do you want me to post the budgets... And yes I have consulted F&G and they have also tried twice themselves to get it so dont know where you are getting your idea they dont want it from.. I also tried when I was a NZ F&G national Councillor, consulting the Maoris to no avail. But times have changed and the payment to Tuwharetoa is not linked to the fishing license sales any more so there is no reason for it to stay managed by a department who (some staff) hate trout and have openly said so. However it is a problem for them to be managing an introduced species alongside protecting native fish..
Are you aware of what is going on at Taupo?



Posted By: makka
Date Posted: 11 Aug 2017 at 7:47pm
And how many of the people who currently buy taupo licences don't also buy F&G licences? I think your numbers are way off.

Would F&G do a better job than DOC? For sure, no argument there, is it going to happen, I doubt it.

There are big changes coming up for the government and F&G, so anything is possible though


Posted By: gunangler
Date Posted: 11 Aug 2017 at 7:51pm
We crunched the numbers when we did the Taupo Fishery review.. There will be a loss to the system but also some gains ... It does work....


Posted By: makka
Date Posted: 11 Aug 2017 at 9:39pm
So, if you have crunched the numbers, where is the extra $1.5m coming from, it certainly won't be from extra licence sales, would it be an increased national licence cost?
I'm sure the rest of the country would love to be left with the burden that is taupo


Posted By: KikBac
Date Posted: 11 Aug 2017 at 9:48pm
I have recently heard from 2 different sources (Taupo Sports Fishing Club President and a Taupo based professional fly fishing guide) that the Taupo trout fishery is absolutely thriving!!! Due to the wet summer and mild winter, lake levels have been maintained at 100% full with loads of smelt and koura present. As a result there are loads of good sized trout available. In fact the daily bag limit for the Taupo region has just been increased from 3 to 6 fish per angler per day. The current governance system for the Taupo fishery seems to be working really well - what is the motivation for change?

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Beer: the most important meal of the day.


Posted By: Fishb8
Date Posted: 12 Aug 2017 at 6:56am
Used to be a real pain having to shell out for 3 different licences for Rotorua, Taupo and the rest.
Can remember coming back from fishing below Huka Falls (remember the ropes you had to use to get to the ledge?) and someone told me I needed a Rotorua licence to fish there.


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Be yourself; everyone else is already taken


Posted By: Bigfishbob
Date Posted: 12 Aug 2017 at 1:04pm
Talking to a Doc Ranger on the Tongariro last Sunday a big chunk of license fees go to Ngati Tu Wharetoa. Why would Fish and Game want Taupo, when they'd get no extra license fees, if there was a one New Zealand License, and then they have to pay a big chunk to Ngati Tuwharetoa?

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www.waikatosportfishing.co.nz


Posted By: gunangler
Date Posted: 12 Aug 2017 at 5:23pm
That goes to show you how little DoC and its staff know about the fishery.
that is totally incorrect information. The Tuwharetoa were paid a sum from the crown purse equivalent to half of license sales.  note from the crown purse and that license sales were used as the measure to establish the amount.
After the settlement in I think 2008 they are paid a set sum from government which is indexed.  The payment is for all people of NZ to enjoy access to the lake... The total sum raised by license sales is used to manage the fishery HOWEVER the crown takes a big chunk as an asset tax... forget what they call it... That few hundred grand would go back to the fishery instead of into government coffers... The assets were paid for by anglers in the first place from license money and its a bloody cheek for government to charge an annual  fee for anglers to use those assets...


Posted By: MacSkipper
Date Posted: 12 Aug 2017 at 6:20pm
interesting to understand the system.  Looking at buying 1 year license for Lake Taupo Trout - $90 and one year boat ramp permit (harbourmaster) $90.
 
Would love to see all that go into management of lake....


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Good fishing trip nothing breaks, great trip catch fish.


Posted By: makka
Date Posted: 13 Aug 2017 at 7:04pm
I still don't think you have answered the question of why would F&G want taupo and what would they gain from it?


Posted By: Fishb8
Date Posted: 14 Aug 2017 at 7:52am
Originally posted by flyfisher flyfisher wrote:

Needs to be done and makes perfect sense, the doc Taupo management was always the "odd child" on the NZ freshwater scene... while they are at it, lump Rotoaira under the same umbrella, that's a mess of a mis-managed fishery!
Rotoaira is a different kettle of fish (excuse the pun).
Back in the 19th century when trout were introduced into Lake Taupo, the introduced trout ate all the local fish - a major food source for Maori. The local iwi, asked that no trout to be released into Lake Rotoaira...but someone did. As mitigation, Tuwharetoa were given ownership/control of the lake.



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Be yourself; everyone else is already taken


Posted By: upstream
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2017 at 10:21am
Maybe Fish and Game would do a better job of managing the fishery. Probably the main thing that Fish and Game have going for them is that they are accountable to anglers because they are elected by their constituency.

However, it is clear that Taupo region requires a lot more management than other regions and DOC staff do a lot in terms of track maintenance, license checks and surveys, fish population monitoring, etc. There would need to be sufficient revenue generated to continue to do these things. If F&G took over the only additional revenue that they would get would be the license fees of those that only fish Taupo, which I suggest is a fraction of the current Taupo license sales. Some modelling would be required to see if this is enough to pay for the costs.

Perhaps there could be an option to add a "Taupo supplement" to F&G licenses for those who also want to fish Taupo. Could be an extra $25 per season. Those who only want to fish Taupo could be accommodated in the existing "local area only" category in the F&G licenses?


Posted By: makka
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2017 at 12:52pm
Alan has gone quiet, I'm not surprised considering the holes in his poorly thought through idea


Posted By: Bigfishbob
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2017 at 4:00pm
What is there that needs a management? It's a completely wild fishery, we keep being told. Aside from keeping the hatchery going, whatever that does for a wild fishery, and keep Rangers in the lifestyle to which they have become accustomed, where does the money go, and why would F&G take on additional responsible for no additional income.

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www.waikatosportfishing.co.nz


Posted By: Fishb8
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2017 at 4:28pm
Do smolt still get released in the lake?
I remember a few times over 10 years ago when they were released into the lake by the boating club at S end of lake.
Undeliverable/wanted for some other region.

Where does the Auckland/Waikato region get their trout stocks from?


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Be yourself; everyone else is already taken


Posted By: Snuffit.
Date Posted: 17 Aug 2017 at 9:55am
Originally posted by Fishb8 Fishb8 wrote:



Where does the Auckland/Waikato region get their trout stocks from?

Eastern Region has a thriving business in trout rearing/sales. That's partly why they are able to employ a veritable contingent of fields staff compared to say A/W which has one fisheries guy for the whole region... and that's where A/W get their fish from.


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You cant eat my toast fish


Posted By: Rainbow
Date Posted: 17 Aug 2017 at 11:36am
Pointless discussion as Ngāti Tūwharetoa position has not yet been sorted out.    

Rainbow


Posted By: makka
Date Posted: 17 Aug 2017 at 12:53pm
Originally posted by Rainbow Rainbow wrote:

Pointless discussion as Ngāti Tūwharetoa position has not yet been sorted out.    

Rainbow


Nor has the F&G position


Posted By: flyfisher
Date Posted: 17 Aug 2017 at 1:32pm
"Rotoaira is a different kettle of fish (excuse the pun).
Back in the 19th century when trout were introduced into Lake Taupo, the introduced trout ate all the local fish - a major food source for Maori. The local iwi, asked that no trout to be released into Lake Rotoaira...but someone did. As mitigation, Tuwharetoa were given ownership/control of the lake."


Interesting, never knew that.


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https://www.youtube.com/user/troutboynz



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