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Potential problem.?

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    Posted: 10 Jan 2018 at 8:37pm
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Titanium
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Honda 40. When sitting at home i leave motor trimed so skeg is about 10-15 cm above floor. But within a couple of days it has slipped right down so skeg is hard up resting on floor boards. Is this sort of slippage normal,or pending hydraulic issue.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote feeder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jan 2018 at 8:48pm
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Not normal, must be bypassing seals, my one (yammie) sits for weeks at a time and never moves.
 
Cheers
The only bar to frequent is the Kawhia Bar
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote JustAnotherSpearo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jan 2018 at 8:57pm
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Yeah nah not normal.. Think of the amount of monkeys that tow their outboards long distances relying on the hydraulics to hold their motor up.. (I say monkeys because I wouldn't risk that ever)

as Feeder said, Suzuki DF90hp is trimmed so skeg is 15cm or so off the ground when it goes into its shed for bed time. Hasn't dipped once in 4 years and gets pulled out every 1-2 weeks on average
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote smudge Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jan 2018 at 9:04pm
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I've had my boat about 7 years Cirrus, it's always done that. Technically it shouldn't but unless it sinks fairly rapidly I wouldn't be too concerned


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Definitely something going on John. Most likely the center seal on the ram but strange for an outboard as new as I think yours is. Could also be a valve inside the ram I guess. First thing I would do is try and top up the ram fluid and then run the engine up and down 4 or 5 times before leaving it sitting again to see if it still happens. also check after running the ram if there is any sight of oil weepage around the ram shaft seals..
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote cirrus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jan 2018 at 9:18pm
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Titanium
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Thanks everyone for the prompt replies. Clearly it should not be doing that. Will follow advice and do a few checks. Come to think of it last few trips out the trim dropped markedly a couple of times when motoring and drifting .Thought nothing of it and just trimmed it up again. So question is if i go out before the issue is dealt to what could potentially go wrong.? Just wishing i knew more about the mechanical side of motors.
Ironically the warranty expires in 4 weeks.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Tagit Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Jan 2018 at 8:07am
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Call it now for warranty work.
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Titanium
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Think about this.. a digger, bob cat , whatever, you park it up , you drop thr bucket and leave all the hydraulics unloaded on the ground.
 Your trim is the same.
 Always drop motor vertical, even just resting on a block of wood.
 As mentioned above ,along the same lines, never travel supported by the hydraulics...
 And also , cover the engine vents from weather, when parked up.. water in the vents lays in the engine bay.. causes corrosion, and on some makes, eg mercs, this corrodes the shaft/ bush that goes down to change gears.. stiff gear change.. new cable , doest fix it.

 Add it that , I believe most OBs are designed to fully drain correctly in the vertical position.

 As to sinking.. hydraulics dont unless you bleed , or by pass.. or gave a bad seal that does by pass.
 Think about it.. does you car brake pedal slowly fade sink?
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Big -Dave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jan 2018 at 9:53pm
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There is a screw in the side of the trim/tilt unit, to release the hydraulic oil if you have an electrical or similar failure.
If it is not tight, you will experience creeping of the hydraulics.
If it is not that, it's a warranty issue.
you can't fix an idiot with duct tape, but it does muffle them for a while...
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Playtime123 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jan 2018 at 10:03pm
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So if you shouldn't travel using just your hydraulics what do you use ?
I was told not to use the engines lock while travelling as this should only be used for servicing. I had a plastic clamp that fitted over the hydraulic shaft, this split after about a month and I never lowered the outboard right down on to it. When I asked my service agent about it he said don't worry about using it for short trips.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Big -Dave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jan 2018 at 10:12pm
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Originally posted by Playtime123 Playtime123 wrote:

So if you shouldn't travel using just your hydraulics what do you use ?
I was told not to use the engines lock while travelling as this should only be used for servicing. I had a plastic clamp that fitted over the hydraulic shaft, this split after about a month and I never lowered the outboard right down on to it. When I asked my service agent about it he said don't worry about using it for short trips.

My current motor has one of the locks broken, long trips I suspect, and it had the hydraulic motor replaced recently.
I got a 50 mm dia lump of umphwe, bored and slotted it to clip over the tilt ram shaft, and lower the motor on to it.
you can't fix an idiot with duct tape, but it does muffle them for a while...
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote CanadianJohn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jan 2018 at 10:47pm
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you can get an engine support thingy from most chandleries. has a fork on each end, one goes on the leg of your motor above the prop and other end fits over the frame of your trailer.

other then on my mac boats where you HAVE to use one of those, i’ve always just used the engine locks.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote smudge Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jan 2018 at 11:33pm
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I don't understand why it's wrong to use the engine locks. I always have.


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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote JustAnotherSpearo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jan 2018 at 2:13am
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Originally posted by smudge smudge wrote:

I don't understand why it's wrong to use the engine locks. I always have.


Agreed Smudge.. old neighbor who has sadly passed found out the hard way they are stronger than some may think.. (they held up as he tried to trim down and he buggered his hydraulics. Cant remember exactly was 8 at the time. Will ask Dad in the tomorrow arvo)

Id prefer to potentially break those than have stress on the system as a whole. 2hrs towing northland roads is just brutal on equipment.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Steps Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jan 2018 at 10:09am
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Titanium
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I don't understand why it's wrong to use the engine locks. I always have.

Yep.. Check johnson/ evinrude Owner and the Service/ Install/ Repair manuals and thats what they say... either travel in vertical if have the ground clearance, and if not the bracket... from memory in bold type.. again from memory they call it a " trailering bracket"

 Other brands, check your manuals, I know some do say fine, others I dont know.

 Macs.. plastic boats are a very different kettle of fish thu. these need to be supported separate to the boat due to the momentum weight of the motor on the stern...
 Again  read the boat manual.. even give them a ring and ask.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote letsgetem Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jan 2018 at 2:32pm
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I susoect that the risk of travelling on engine locks alone, will vary with the age and brand and model of motor. eg cant imagine any risk with say a 50hp motor compared to huge weight like a 300hp motor.
 
Ive got Honda 60hp, 3 years old, and travel long distances only on engine locks. No problem.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Schampy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Jan 2018 at 4:45pm
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This is interesting... I never tow on the engine lock. Was told buy the boat dealer not to and after seeing my brother break his engine lock (exact same engine too) I was under the impression the lock is just there for servicing etc.
You think about it.... whats the difference to the stress levels on the hydraulic ram and boat transom whether the boat is being towed for 3 hours ? or you are doing a round trip to the arse end of nowhere chasing fish. 
I would much rather replace a hydraulic ram in 15 years time.....In my brothers case when the engine lock broke it smashed off a huge chunk of the transom mounting bracket.  He tows his boat from Nelson to Matauri bay and back a couple of times a year. Prolly a bit more that ya average punter.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Joker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jan 2018 at 10:23am
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On my Merc 90 it came with a blue "C" shaped plastic section that just clips over the hydraulic ram whilst towing and works perfectly.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Rozboon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jan 2018 at 3:04pm
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When the engine is tilted fully up there's a lot of weight (gearbox, prop, skeg etc) hanging way, way out from the transom bouncing up and down, it places a large twisting force on the transom. I was watching a Sea Nymph 14'6 with a modern Merc 60 4 stroke getting towed recently just on the engine lock and the amount of flex it was generating in the transom when it hit a bump was painful to watch.
The Mac 4.2 I fish a lot off has had to be welded after it was driven out the Coromandel peninsula without an outboard support and it cracked both sides of the transom off the pontoons.

Hence I'm a big believer in supporting the motor with a dedicated support, rather than the hydraulics or the locking lever.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote clank Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Jan 2018 at 10:22pm
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Hey playtime 123, the previous two motors I owned were Yamahas purchased new and the manuals said do not use the tilt lock bracket for trailoring and that it's for service only. I bought a special Yamaha product which was a hard rubber ram type thing that fitted over the trim rams that the motor lowered down on to, I used it for long trips. It did set the motor quite low, no problem for along the road but did need to watch elevated driveway entrances etc. the funny thing is it took a while to find one because most yami dealers have never heard of it and told me to put it on the lock.

Following this and the endless problems I had with Yamahas I bought a 250 Verado and that manual specifically said to rest it on the lock for trailoring, so I suppose all brands are different.

I would go with the user manual for that motor and not listen to dealers

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