TLD 30 drag

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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote laidbackdood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Sep 2016 at 9:40pm
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Sounds like the pre spool drag is set too high to me......back the drag off to nothing and turn that dial down.........then drag to strike.......measure your drag to 8 kg at strike off the rod.........then you should have a progressive smooth drag from freespool.....it should be gradual........if its not........somethings ****ed....Damage has been done,.........these things are bullet proof and have a long warranty for good reason.
we have to ask the question....Did you or your mate adjust that tension dial with the drag lever engaged?..........No offence to you bro.......just trying to helpWink
Once the idiots turn up..Im outta here...No time for Drama Queens.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Alan L Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Sep 2016 at 7:49am
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I certainly didn't adjust the tension dial with drag on. I will have to check with my mate. But you wouldn't expect the gamefish guy down the road would have either - that rule applies to all reels as far as I know. I have a 2 spd TLD 30 I've used for yrs with no issues. I may have even set the original drag on these (my mate never had any scales til about a month ago). 
But it looks like we need to pull the drag apart. I did pull the tension cap off both and had a look to see if any cam issues I could detect. Everything 'looked' fine.
But I will go back and investigate further, now I have some things to check. He may have a manual for them - never thought to ask.
Can anyone explain what Kikbac means by () and not (()) orientation of the washers - so I know what I'm checking. I'm in Vanuatu and my good TLD is in NZ so I have nothing to compare too.
Laidbackdood - thats what I have done with these reels - after pulling the tension caps and looking at the drag cam. I reset the drags just as you suggest. Perfect. problem fixed - whatever it was. Smooth drag progression and 8kg at strike. Next time we take them out, same problem. 
Thanks
Alan
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Nomis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Sep 2016 at 8:25am
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Can anyone explain what Kikbac means by () and not (()) orientation of the washers - so I know what I'm checking. I'm in Vanuatu and my good TLD is in NZ so I have nothing to compare too.
Laidbackdood - thats what I have done with these reels - after pulling the tension caps and looking at the drag cam. I reset the drags just as you suggest. Perfect. problem fixed - whatever it was. Smooth drag progression and 8kg at strike. Next time we take them out, same problem. 
Thanks
Alan
[/QUOTE]

He is referring to the spring washer set up on the main shaft of the reel - if you have this wrong it will affect your drag range dramatically and or free spool 
I'll act my age when im 69
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Alan L Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Sep 2016 at 12:57pm
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Just checked with my mate. He swears he hasn't touched the drags. So my guess is kikbac wins the prize. Thanks for the info guys. Will let you know once we pull them apart in the next day or so.
he got no manuals with the reels - just a warranty card.
Regards
Alan 
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote OuttaHere Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Sep 2016 at 1:13pm
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To explain the ()() vs (()) - there are 4 washers on the left side of the spool in a stack. They aren't flat, they are in fact cupped "belleville" washers and they actually provide most of the spring tension that clamps the drag plate onto the drag washer.
If they are assembled ()() they will in effect be softer, which makes for a more progressive drag curve but less outright clamping force (and therefore drag output)
If they have been stacked (()) then the opposite occurs.
 
But it could well just be differently profiled cams between the reels...
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Wefaknis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Sep 2016 at 3:39pm
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maybe this Alan L

http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=36.0


were hes got the micrometer out

Cheers

Wefakins
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Alan L Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Sep 2016 at 6:15pm
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Thanks guys. Awesome. I'm sure I got enough info to proceed now. Will let you know in a day or two. 
Just got back from being beaten up with wind and waves trying to catch dinner.  Luckily some meat in fridge.
Thanks heaps
Alan
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote laidbackdood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2016 at 12:01am
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Hope you fix the problem doodWink...so do you mean its fine now but next time you use it,.......you think it will lock up again? If so .....I question the state of the drag washers.........Drag always backed off after every use? never left on strike for extended period of time?
I know its sounds common sense and i dont mean to insult your intelligence but i have seen plenty leave their drags right up.....and store their reels with drags left on......its surprising.....that pre drag knob doesnt need to be turned much ..for the strike drag to reach 8kg.......Good luck.......will be interesting to find out what was wrong.....my pick is drag washers compacted.
Once the idiots turn up..Im outta here...No time for Drama Queens.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Alan L Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2016 at 2:01pm
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OK, maybe we found the problem? I can't find any dish shape in these washers if I am looking at the right washers. I can't find any orientation. This is how they are on the shaft as I pulled it out.
Presumably the dish should be more obvious?
Thanks
Alan
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Alan L Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2016 at 2:02pm
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Pic didn't seem to attach
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Alan L Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2016 at 2:21pm
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I do believe we have found the problem as per Kikbac s posting. I flipped the washers as pairs and could see a slight gap in the middle. When I put the sets together again like that I get the following pic - which looks different. I do believe they have been assembled (()).
But now, how do I get the circlip back on - not much room. Is it permissible to remove the small washer between the drag washers and bearing?
Thanks
Alan

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Post Options Post Options   Likes (1) Likes(1)   Quote Alan L Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2016 at 2:47pm
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Dropped out one spacer type washer between bearing and drag washers. That still leaves one thin washer against the bearing. As long as that is OK, I think we are good to go. reel feels perfect - just like my old one. I would say Shimano have an assembly/production problem.
Thanks guys. Awesome. 
Kikbac gets the choc fish.
The reels had the drags off when I received them. I don't think my mate has done anything to damage them.
Regards
Alan
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote laidbackdood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2016 at 7:53pm
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wow.......you are getting down to the nitty grits now........Hope it works out for youWink
Once the idiots turn up..Im outta here...No time for Drama Queens.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Alan L Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2016 at 10:39pm
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The reel/drag feels great. perfect. Hopefully it holds up. When we have pulled the tension knob apart and reassembled, it felt good for a few minutes then failed again.  I have tested this now at strike and sunset, repeatedly and it is perfect everytime and smooth and progressive. like it should be. I am sure Shimano have/had a problem with the assembly of these reels. I believe that is what cost us a marlin on near the first outing for the reel pre xmas. Trying to show my mate how to catch a mahi before I headed back to NZ, so used his gear and boat but my lures since he had none. Instead of a mahi we got a decent/large marlin. Him on the rod, me on the boat. It peeled about 200m on first run, and ping. Gone. drag was still below strike. And my new lure gone. Moral of story - I don't run my lures on anyone else's gear now unless it is cheap, and replaceable. I haven't been able to replace that one. Should send the bill to Shimano.
Thanks for the help guys - I learnt something.
Regards
Alan
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote KikBac Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Sep 2016 at 11:47pm
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Glad it worked out Alan.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote laidbackdood Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Sep 2016 at 3:09am
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Originally posted by KikBac KikBac wrote:

Glad it worked out Alan.
Me too.......but id feel more secure after you have landed a few fishWink
Once the idiots turn up..Im outta here...No time for Drama Queens.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Alan L Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Sep 2016 at 7:10am
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Me too.......but id feel more secure after you have landed a few fishWink
[/QUOTE]
Me to. Working on it. Smile But it feels so much better.
Thanks kikbac. Spot on info. So, a couple more to do down road with same problem. And my Aussie neighbour turns up last nite for a bit of fishing - and brings with him.... 2 x TLD 30s (new) for a couple of local boys as gifts. I will need to check them too, before he hands them over. Will be interesting to see if they have sorted the assembly problem yet.
Alan 
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Nomis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Sep 2016 at 8:40am
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Hi Alan

Why didn't you just send it to us (shimano nz)  if you believed there was a assembly issue? - I highly doubt there was a assembly issue as QC checks are seriously stringent and checking drag is a pretty obvious issue. Thousands of TLD30's on the market and cant say ive seen / heard of any manufacturing faults with 99.99 percent of what we sell - 

If there ever was what you feel to be a genuine issue you can return your reel to us for inspection - we service and repair all Shimano reels in house and have 3 full time servicemen that live and breathe Shimano reels, Im sure between us we could find any fault whether it be manufacturing / assembly / or user error. 
I'll act my age when im 69
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Alan L Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Sep 2016 at 7:33pm
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The reels are in Vanuatu. Much easier if we could resolve it here.
Just back from fishing on another boat - same problem on a Tiagra 30W. You move the drag one notch past free spool and it locks solid.
I guess we will have to have a look tomorrow or soon. Not saying same issue. Don't know. But it has an issue.
Regards
Alan
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Alan L Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Sep 2016 at 7:47pm
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If I was in NZ I rpobably would do that(altho they aren't my reels), and given they are probably still under warranty it would make sense. But the postage is real slow at the moment with Air NZ not flying to Vtu (I know , I been waiting for some) auto parts - several weeks there and back.
If the posting by Kikbac is correct regarding the pre load washer orientation, then they were definitely assembled incorrectly. The pic I posted was as they came out of the spool - they had not been off the shaft. My mate definitely has not had the reels apart, so could only have happened at assembly.
regards
Alan 
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