Snapper noodling

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    Posted: 19 May 2013 at 8:22pm
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Having only just learned the technique from Matto about two months ago, I'm completely sold on raising snapper using scraps of pillie. It's very engaging fishing, even when the snapper don't show up immediately. It's still fun watching the hiwihiwi and other reef grotties all lit up and fighting over the scraps.

Yesterday was exceptional, as the snapper were there virtually immediately. The water was quite murky, which might have had an effect.

One downside to be aware of is the bloody gulls, which will swoop in and take every morsel you chuck. I've found that false casting keeps them at a more respectful distance. 

Another downside is that your hands get pretty gross from shredding pillies and chucking them in. I use an Alvey belt bucket to hold the pillies, and if I start the day with them frozen, I cut them into thin disks. This means you get a piece of bait that has great vis, but doesn't have a lot of bulk, so won't fill the fish up. However as the day goes on and the pillies get soft, it's easier to just shred them with your hands. This means the pillie blood, oil and guts gets everywhere. I have a rag on my belt too, but this gets pretty foul pretty quick.

So now I'm looking at other options. Am going to give this a try next time: cat food, delivered straight from the tin with a flicking stick of some kind. Maybe just an old dessert spoon. This catfood is sardines in gelatin with a bit of preservative, and is $1.09 a can at the supermarket. Will have to wait a long week till I get to try it. Any thoughts, Craig, Matto or anyone else?


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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Bushkid2 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 May 2013 at 8:33pm
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your cat will be jealous at least. should work but it think that  between being cooked and coated in gelatine you may not get as good a scent release, that said is it vision or smell that attracts the fish? fish are always watching other fish so if something eats it your target species are bound to show up. dont foget a tin opener tho.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote matto Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 May 2013 at 9:28pm
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Hi Ahab,I don,t think anything will beat tiny chunks of pilchard,there is a fine line and then it's just like using burley.i think it's the visual combined with sink rate that gains attention ,once in range I suspect scent kicks in.Of late my interest is in just fishing fly,keeping moving and placing minimal casts and moving on.I am not a fan of blind casting alot as I think the fish spook quickly and I like to present flies to new water.snapper.I have had a few nice snapper and hooked a good king doing this in the boat but until we get an electric motor the drifts are very short.I will be looking to do more of this over winter from boat and shore.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote bass-ist Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 May 2013 at 9:33pm
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Use the cat.....
You'll get a big ass kingie
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Shilo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 May 2013 at 10:02pm
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The seagulls are a pain but the secret is to hide what you are doing from them.  Look around before throwing a pilly bit in and make sure there are no winged white rats watching from a rock or overhead.  If there are don't show any pilly and just wait until they land then throw a rock at them, they will circle and then land again so repeat.  Seagulls are lazy so if you keep them moving and not feed them they will soon bugger off to find a bait fisherman to annoy.   If you don't scare them off their roost then another will soon join and you will have twice the problem.

If they have a chance of getting a feed they will hang around no matter what you do, so best to avoid them from getting a feed from the start.  Luckily you only need a few small bits of pilly per spot so can afford to wait them out.  If they don't see you throw in a bit they will not hang around for long.

Also another reason gulls can be a pain is that I have often seen large snapper take of in terror because of a seagull flying overhead.  Left over instinct from when it was small enough to be eaten? 

For messy hands I just wash them after each time & before picking up the rod.  Not the best since there are places where there is no small rock pool close by but ok 90% of the time.

Oh yeah forgot - frozen means it will float and the gulls will get it.  So to avoid I normally throw 3-4 pillies into a rock pool to thaw out as soon as I get to a possie and while I gear up. 
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote SufixRockMan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 May 2013 at 11:28pm
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I worry about you sometimes Tom.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote EditB Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 May 2013 at 4:42pm
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Tom, what about a stainless tube/straw, stab it into the pille & and pea shoot like an old school spitball?

I do not lie about fishing, I willingly participate in a campaign of misinformation.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Ahab Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 May 2013 at 8:11pm
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Thanks for the comments, all.

Bass-ist, great idea about using our little Luna for live bait- regrettably, she's afraid of the water! Incidentally, I have tied up some little nymphs out of her (shed) fur, and the piper like them. Unfortunately, the piper just race up, take one snap and expel. I'm not fast enough to strike them. Might try tying up some little willow-grub type flies with rubber etc so there is a bit more chew-ability.

Island Paddler, that's really useful stuff, thanks. I didn't consider the fact that the fish may be cooked. Also a good trick about the gulls. I've actually been mulling it over more, and been wondering if bits of crab floating down would have a similar effect to pillies. I'd say that 9/10 of the snapper I get from the bricks are full of either crab and/or kina.  It would be easy enough to catch a few crabs and try this out.

EditB, that sounds like a good delivery method, provided the pillie is of the right consistency for the pea shooter. This method also has appeal because it adds to the primal nature of the hunt, to go with my loincloth and face-paint. 

Simon/Noschist, sanity and flyfishing have never been easy bedfellows!
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Shilo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 May 2013 at 10:06am
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Kina are great if you can get them over low tide.  1-2 kina per area you want to attract the snapper, but don't crush them too much as you want all the gooey bits still stuck to the shell so they sink to the bottom.  I like to just split them in half with a knife and throw them into an area I can see where they reach the bottom. 
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote matto Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 May 2013 at 10:29am
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Hi Islandpaddler , your ideas /strategies for dealing with gulls was gold - wise words from the experienced.Most other techniques throwing things ,blind casting etc do spook snapper.My observation is that its the quick arm movements more so than the splashes when throwing. It's not until you have a really big snapper in front of you that you learn how observant and flighty they can be, while the 1-3 kg guys are bold in comparison. It is difficult to convince people about how sealthy to be until they have personally had a big fish up close and then spooked it with the slightest head movement or swing of a fly rod.It's one of those situations where you don't know what fish might have turned up if you were super sleathy , hidden and only pitched a few tiny morsels.Until people see it , the impulse to stand up and blind cast is really strong. I am now looking forward to the winter really kicking in as the rocks are still busy with lots of baitfish and smaller snapper.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Ahab Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 May 2013 at 2:02pm
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Interesting stuff Matto. I might put a bit more thought into camouflage. Will look for clothes that match the colours of the background rocks.



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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Shilo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 May 2013 at 4:33pm
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My current thoughts are that camouflage won't make any difference. You can stand a couple of feet from a foraging snapper and he will never know you are there, but make one slight movement and it will take off.  Its not the shape of a human the snapper thinks of as a threat but unusual things happening like part of that tall "rock" moving.

So long as the clothing isn't bright and totally outlandish and is fairly neutral then it should be OK.  Main thing is to hide any movement at all, e.g. if in the snappers sight then don't wave arms saying "look at that!" etc and instead of moving sideways - slowly move directly backwards (so the "rock" seems to shrink in size & doesn't register as movement).

Of course if you turn up in pink tights then all bets are off and I doubt it will only be the snapper taking off into the distance.



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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote FishMan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 May 2013 at 6:06pm
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I'd have to agree with you there IP, but movement is more visible if you're brightly coloured than if you're not.

If the sun is behind me I figure I'm nothing more than a silhouette anyway, so I stand right up beside the water... but I try not to move at all (it's very hard to cast while not moving!)

One thing I don't do is wear white gumboots while fishing. I know people who do..     Pig


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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Ahab Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 May 2013 at 1:52pm
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A couple of camo options:





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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Shilo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 May 2013 at 3:23pm
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Unfortunately with that 1st option you will have to throw rocks at yourself.  This could be hard to do and I imagine will scare the snapper.  Also you have to be careful that another fisherman hasn't employed option 2 to get rid of the gulls..... :)


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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Bushkid2 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 May 2013 at 5:54pm
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white gumboots are fish magnets Craig, go wash your mouth out with Kitty poop.
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Jwest Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 May 2013 at 8:30pm
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I've used cat food successfully to berley up mullet, piper, jmaks, smells quite sheit though. 
As always some great info on stalking fish and snapper habits here that I reckon is applicable accross the landbased board, always thinking you SWFers!
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Post Options Post Options   Likes (0) Likes(0)   Quote Ahab Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 May 2013 at 12:35pm
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Originally posted by Jwest Jwest wrote:

As always some great info on stalking fish and snapper habits here that I reckon is applicable accross the landbased board, always thinking you SWFers!

Yeah I've been thinking exactly the same thing, Joel. You could follow the exact same principles, only with filthy, stinking bait! I wish I'd known about this type of fishing when I was still a baito. Sight fishing is a very different type of excitement to watching a rod-tip go tap-tap-tap and then that beautiful drawing of line as the fish moves off. Both great ways to fish, but I'm loving the sight fishing at the moment.

In fact, I think Craig got into this type of fishing because an old geezer told him about noodling up big snapper with kinas, then get them on a handline!

Another very interesting and useful point that Craig/et.al have raised here is that kings behave very differently when they know you're there. Perhaps this is one of the reasons behind those infuriating kings that come in and just stooge around ignoring everything? Maybe a stealth approach would bring in more bites?
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